Student-teacher dynamics vs. parent-teacher dynamics

Susan James said:

I'm sorry, I didn't quite catch that! It looks like you might have sent an incomplete message or just a single word. If there was something specific you wanted to chat about or a post you wanted me to look at, just let me know—I'm all ears! kaže:
How much have you actually gotten involved in cases like this in your work as a psychologist? 😕 I can't quite get a clear sense of what's going on from this post.

In Denmark, when a kid starts acting out, they don't just leave parents to sit around wondering what they could have done differently. Instead, they step in with family therapy to tackle the issue head-on.

Do I really need to hand over my full resume, my current office address, my kids' names, their whole family tree, and even my shoe size just to have an equal seat at the table in this discussion?

☕

In Denmark, just like anywhere else in the States, psychotherapy is entirely voluntary. It’s something people choose to do when they feel ready and actually want the support, rather than something being forced upon them by anyone else.
I truly believe that real change in psychotherapy only starts to happen when we stop looking outward and start asking the individual: "What are you actually willing to do for yourself?" It’s about shifting that focus back to personal agency and what someone truly wants for their own life.
Even a psychotherapist—and that's true whether they're from here or even from Denmark—doesn't possess any kind of magic powers.

I'm sorry, I didn't quite catch that! It looks like your message might have been cut off. Feel free to send over whatever you were working on, and I'll be happy to help you get it polished up! kaže:
[

Just to clarify my point here—looking at this equation, I don't see any mention of parental involvement or the input from a school psychologist. It feels like everything is being placed solely on the teacher's shoulders. They’re either stuck just logging how many mistakes a kid makes during class, or they're left wondering what else they can possibly do to help.
It feels like some teachers act like they have superpowers, thinking they can just single-handedly fix everything or sweep away any fallout from their actions. Honestly, who knows what kind of deep-seated issues or past traumas might be driving that need to be all-powerful?

Guys, please—read between the lines!
If you honestly believe that only teachers play a role in this, while psychologists and parents are somehow excluded from the equation, then I think we’ve reached a bit of an impasse.

Hey, let me re-read my post one more time. I’m curious—what makes you think I was only talking about teachers? I never claimed they were all-powerful, nor did I say that anyone has the ability or the obligation to fix every single trauma someone might be dealing with.

Jesper Jull has noted in his books that over there, they even implement family therapy as early as preschool if a child displays problematic behavior.
Now, obviously, you can't force anyone to do anything, but recommending family therapy is simply part of the standard protocol.

As for everything else, this seems to be about specific cases from your own practice (given how the question was framed), so I assume when you mentioned "not stopping at recording a student's dogs in and around the classroom," you weren't referring to yourself or the parents. 🤷 ☕

Ultimately, it is common sense that results are only achieved when everyone pulls in the same direction—a point that has been hammered home multiple times in this thread: without parental support, there is no progress.

I think a parent's mindset is absolutely critical—maybe even make-or-break. We’re all wired differently, and everyone handles the truth differently. One thing I’m certain of: we are incredibly subjective and instinctively defensive when it comes to our own kids. Because of that, how a teacher approaches a parent is everything. I’ve noticed two distinct ways this goes down:
1. ''Look, I'm calling because your kid is a nightmare. They're disrupting the whole class, getting into fights during recess...''

2. ''I'm calling because we've noticed some behavioral issues with your child, and I'd love for us to team up to figure this out. We really need your help here.''

How do you experts view this? How do you actually handle these calls? Which approach gets better results—regardless of whether the parent is a professor, a blue-collar worker, an alcoholic, or someone dealing with PTSD?

Jessica Howard5 said:I think a parent's mindset is absolutely critical—maybe even make-or-break. We’re all wired differently, and everyone handles the truth differently. One thing I’m certain of: we are incredibly subjective and instinctively defensive when it comes to our own kids. Because of that, how a teacher approaches a parent is everything. I’ve noticed two distinct ways this goes down:
1. ''Look, I'm calling because your kid is a nightmare. They're disrupting the whole class, getting into fights during recess...''

2. ''I'm calling because we've noticed some behavioral issues with your child, and I'd love for us to team up to figure this out. We really need your help here.''

How do you experts view this? How do you actually handle these calls? Which approach gets better results—regardless of whether the parent is a professor, a blue-collar worker, an alcoholic, or someone dealing with PTSD?

I couldn't agree more. I’ve only had to call parents twice so far, and I can't say I didn't occasionally wonder, "Who on earth raised this little monster?" But both times, I ended up dealing with these poor, exhausted parents who were working themselves to the bone from dawn till dusk, while their kid's behavior had spiraled so badly it was practically abusive toward them. 🤷

Emily Gonzalez51 said:I couldn't agree more. I’ve only had to call parents twice so far, and I can't say I didn't occasionally wonder, "Who on earth raised this little monster?" But both times, I ended up dealing with these poor, exhausted parents who were working themselves to the bone from dawn till dusk, while their kid's behavior had spiraled so badly it was practically abusive toward them. 🤷

From what I've seen, there are really only two patterns when it comes to family dynamics in these cases. Either you have the heartbreaking scenario I just described—which absolutely floors me as a parent, because I can't even fathom my own child speaking to me that way—
or you run into the second type: the "know-it-all Mr. and Mrs. Perfect Parent." Please, don't take this personally if you fall into that category, because I know there are exceptions, but what I have witnessed is frankly terrifying.
There is this crushing, relentless pressure placed on a child to be "above average" simply because Mom and Dad consider themselves "above average," using those exact, arrogant words.
And you know what the fallout is? At home, these kids are systematically broken down by all sorts of psychological nonsense, and then the moment they step foot in school, they just snap like popcorn.
The one silver lining in all of this is that you actually can get results, provided that teachers, counselors, the principal, and social services all decide to pull together and act as a single unit.
It is truly mind-blowing how much you can achieve just by using the right words to force parents into a corner where cooperation becomes their only option. You essentially back them against a wall until they finally crack—some of them start crying, some actually beg for help, and suddenly, everything starts moving. It’s all about having a well-oiled team, and when that happens, actual miracles can occur.

Emily Gonzalez51 said:Jesper Jull has noted in his books that over there, they even implement family therapy as early as preschool if a child displays problematic behavior.
Now, obviously, you can't force anyone to do anything, but recommending family therapy is simply part of the standard protocol.

As for everything else, this seems to be about specific cases from your own practice (given how the question was framed), so I assume when you mentioned "not stopping at recording a student's dogs in and around the classroom," you weren't referring to yourself or the parents. 🤷 ☕

Ultimately, it is common sense that results are only achieved when everyone pulls in the same direction—a point that has been hammered home multiple times in this thread: without parental support, there is no progress.

Since you brought up Juul, I think it would be really helpful to look closer at the concepts he covers so thoroughly: personal responsibility, relational accountability, social competencies, integrity, cooperation, and treating people with equal dignity... plus so much other stuff that seems to be missing in our American schools and families today.

To me, it almost feels like by constantly pointing toward psychotherapy (because someone recommends it), you're essentially asking someone else to fix the problem (as if nothing can happen without a therapist).
The reality is that therapy isn't always available, nor is it always feasible. Waiting around for a session to happen while doing nothing else because "someone else will handle it" is, frankly, irresponsible.

There is so much we can do in the meantime.
And Juul provides plenty of examples of things that can be done right within an institution (where parents aren't even involved) to address issues, like when a conflict breaks out.
I truly believe that any adult who comes into contact with a child can make a difference and encourage them toward positive change.

Even something as simple as working on a puzzle together can be productive for building rapport, managing conflict, or solving problems. This is true even if a third party thinks a psychologist should be sitting down with a parent—maybe a stressed-out dad or a frantic mom—to deal with the "actual" issue.🤷

I haven't been able to participate in the forum as much as I'd like lately, and I've seen some pretty questionable takes in here. For this topic, I highly recommend the book "From Obedience to Responsibility."

Look, my stance is simple: there are countless critical stages between a preschooler showing behavioral issues and a teenager becoming a delinquent. We need to identify these red flags early and intervene immediately. This shouldn't be a reactive afterthought; it needs to be baked into the system. Right now, it’s a disaster where school staff are just playing firefighter—constantly trying to douse flames instead of actually pulling the weeds out by the roots. If we don't fix the foundation, we'll keep reading tragic stories like that one in The New York Times about the kid who was stabbed at the local pond.

Emily Gonzalez51 said:Look, my stance is simple: there are countless critical stages between a preschooler showing behavioral issues and a teenager becoming a delinquent. We need to identify these red flags early and intervene immediately. This shouldn't be a reactive afterthought; it needs to be baked into the system. Right now, it’s a disaster where school staff are just playing firefighter—constantly trying to douse flames instead of actually pulling the weeds out by the roots. If we don't fix the foundation, we'll keep reading tragic stories like that one in The New York Times about the kid who was stabbed at the local pond.

I definitely see where you're coming from,
but it feels like we're heading back toward the old habit of pointing fingers and shifting blame.
At the end of the day, it's the child who has to face the consequences.

And unfortunately, not every kid gets into preschool.
It isn't mandatory (though I personally think it should be by age 4 or 5), and there simply aren't enough spots available.

(I actually wrote a whole different post about enrollment and preschool tuition explaining why I believe it should be mandatory and accessible to everyone to help prevent these issues down the road.)

Charles Murphy6 said:From what I've seen, there are really only two patterns when it comes to family dynamics in these cases. Either you have the heartbreaking scenario I just described—which absolutely floors me as a parent, because I can't even fathom my own child speaking to me that way—
or you run into the second type: the "know-it-all Mr. and Mrs. Perfect Parent." Please, don't take this personally if you fall into that category, because I know there are exceptions, but what I have witnessed is frankly terrifying.
There is this crushing, relentless pressure placed on a child to be "above average" simply because Mom and Dad consider themselves "above average," using those exact, arrogant words.
And you know what the fallout is? At home, these kids are systematically broken down by all sorts of psychological nonsense, and then the moment they step foot in school, they just snap like popcorn.
The one silver lining in all of this is that you actually can get results, provided that teachers, counselors, the principal, and social services all decide to pull together and act as a single unit.
It is truly mind-blowing how much you can achieve just by using the right words to force parents into a corner where cooperation becomes their only option. You essentially back them against a wall until they finally crack—some of them start crying, some actually beg for help, and suddenly, everything starts moving. It’s all about having a well-oiled team, and when that happens, actual miracles can occur.

You know what I find interesting about this pressure? A child who acts out outwardly becomes an immediate issue. Whether you want to or not, you have to deal with them.

But a child who is crumbling on the inside while appearing perfectly well-behaved and quiet? They stay invisible. Nobody pays attention to them, or worse, people only focus on them to hold them up as the "gold standard" for how everyone else should behave.

So, yeah, I know the teachers here might come for me for saying this, but I actually find it easier to deal with the kids who show their struggles externally rather than internally. The outward ones are literally screaming "help me," whereas the quiet ones just fade away. And unfortunately, sometimes that help doesn't arrive in time.

Jessica Howard5 said:I think a parent's mindset is absolutely critical—maybe even make-or-break. We’re all wired differently, and everyone handles the truth differently. One thing I’m certain of: we are incredibly subjective and instinctively defensive when it comes to our own kids. Because of that, how a teacher approaches a parent is everything. I’ve noticed two distinct ways this goes down:
1. ''Look, I'm calling because your kid is a nightmare. They're disrupting the whole class, getting into fights during recess...''

2. ''I'm calling because we've noticed some behavioral issues with your child, and I'd love for us to team up to figure this out. We really need your help here.''

How do you experts view this? How do you actually handle these calls? Which approach gets better results—regardless of whether the parent is a professor, a blue-collar worker, an alcoholic, or someone dealing with PTSD?

Personally, I stick strictly to number 2. And man, do I get all kinds of reactions...
from amazing teamwork to people literally hanging up on me or making death threats. So, I don't know if it's actually "working," but for my own sake and just to keep my dignity intact, I always talk to parents that way, no matter what kind of mess follows....

It’s absolutely absurd! This whole situation is like trying to drive a semi-truck through a narrow alleyway—completely impossible and utterly chaotic. kaže:
I couldn't agree more. It’s exactly as I've stated before.
Once again, we are witnessing nothing more than a pathetic attempt to dodge accountability and hunt for scapegoats.
And there is a child waiting for us in the future.

I cannot agree with you. Every educator who has contributed to this thread has reached the same conclusion: the system is fundamentally broken, and we have provided plenty of concrete, real-world examples to prove exactly where it's failing.

The rest of the squad basically has their spotlights aimed directly at the instructors. 🙂

I know I’m going to get crucified by every teacher on this forum for saying this, but I honestly have more respect for the students who act out externally than those who suffer in silence. One group is practically screaming "help me" through their behavior, while the other just shuts down entirely. It’s a tragedy when that plea for help goes unnoticed.

I am convinced there are effective ways to ensure even those who refuse to raise their voices are finally noticed. 🤔
As for those who manifest their disorders through outward aggression, there is such a staggering level of incompetence that one is left speechless. When you have a student who sets fire to a trash can in class one day, throws tear gas the next, and spits in another kid's sandwich the third, you are simply paralyzed—especially if you are just starting out in this profession.
It is my firm belief that someone should have intervened with kids like that long before they even reached middle school.

The second breed of parent I’ve encountered is the "pseudo-expert" who thinks they’re a licensed pediatrician. No offense to anyone who actually earned their credentials—there are exceptions—but from what I’ve seen, these self-proclaimed gurus are absolutely exhausting.
The pressure placed on a child to be "above average" simply because their parents claim to be "above average" is nothing short of psychological tyranny. It is an absurd standard that treats children like corporate assets rather than human beings.
It’s absolutely infuriating what is happening. These kids are being systematically bullied at home with all sorts of toxic influences, and then they burst into school like a powder keg ready to explode.

I have to admit, I’ve never encountered anything quite like this. It’s pathetic, honestly—those poor kids.

I’ve noticed something else, and I know it’s true because I have three kids and all three of them bring it up. I remember seeing it during my own school years, too. There are teachers out there who just don't play fair when it comes to grading. You've got some instructors who are incredibly strict and rigid with certain students, yet they have a handful of little favorites they constantly let slide—acting like nobody notices. What’s the reality from your side? Parents, what have you seen? And teachers, be honest: do you actually have those "golden children" you're willing to forgive everything for, while punishing someone else for the exact same mistake?

Emily Gonzalez51 said:

It’s absolutely absurd! This whole situation is like trying to drive a semi-truck through a narrow alleyway—completely impossible and utterly chaotic. kaže:
I couldn't agree more. It’s exactly as I've stated before.
Once again, we are witnessing nothing more than a pathetic attempt to dodge accountability and hunt for scapegoats.
And there is a child waiting for us in the future.

I cannot agree with you. Every educator who has contributed to this thread has reached the same conclusion: the system is fundamentally broken, and we have provided plenty of concrete, real-world examples to prove exactly where it's failing.

The rest of the squad basically has their spotlights aimed directly at the instructors. 🙂

I know I’m going to get crucified by every teacher on this forum for saying this, but I honestly have more respect for the students who act out externally than those who suffer in silence. One group is practically screaming "help me" through their behavior, while the other just shuts down entirely. It’s a tragedy when that plea for help goes unnoticed.

I am convinced there are effective ways to ensure even those who refuse to raise their voices are finally noticed. 🤔
As for those who manifest their disorders through outward aggression, there is such a staggering level of incompetence that one is left speechless. When you have a student who sets fire to a trash can in class one day, throws tear gas the next, and spits in another kid's sandwich the third, you are simply paralyzed—especially if you are just starting out in this profession.
It is my firm belief that someone should have intervened with kids like that long before they even reached middle school.

The second breed of parent I’ve encountered is the "pseudo-expert" who thinks they’re a licensed pediatrician. No offense to anyone who actually earned their credentials—there are exceptions—but from what I’ve seen, these self-proclaimed gurus are absolutely exhausting.
The pressure placed on a child to be "above average" simply because their parents claim to be "above average" is nothing short of psychological tyranny. It is an absurd standard that treats children like corporate assets rather than human beings.
It’s absolutely infuriating what is happening. These kids are being systematically bullied at home with all sorts of toxic influences, and then they burst into school like a powder keg ready to explode.

I have to admit, I’ve never encountered anything quite like this. It’s pathetic, honestly—those poor kids.

No offense intended, but I’m having a hard time buying this. Honestly? I think you might have just missed them because they don't stand out. Like Rhino said, they aren't the type to cause trouble or stick out in a crowd.

And speaking of favorites: looking back at my school days, it was a total mixed bag. 😍 You had those brilliant, no-nonsense professors who only cared about the material. Then you had the sweet, soft-hearted ones who would give out passing grades just because they knew a kid was dealing with some heavy stuff at home. And then, of course, there were the ones who openly played favorites with the kids who sucked up to them or whose parents sent in "thank you" gifts. We even had one teacher who was blatantly biased toward the boys. For a guy, it was all, "Oh, you really didn't learn that, did you? Try harder next time. Sit down, minus five..." But for the girls? "Aww, lovely, lovely! Sit down, plus three..." 🤣 That woman was a local legend in Indianapolis—completely unhinged, actually. We didn't take her too seriously; she was mostly just our favorite person to make fun of.🙂

Emily Gonzalez51 said:

It’s absolutely absurd! This whole situation is like trying to drive a semi-truck through a narrow alleyway—completely impossible and utterly chaotic. kaže:
I couldn't agree more. It’s exactly as I've stated before.
Once again, we are witnessing nothing more than a pathetic attempt to dodge accountability and hunt for scapegoats.
And there is a child waiting for us in the future.

I cannot agree with you. Every educator who has contributed to this thread has reached the same conclusion: the system is fundamentally broken, and we have provided plenty of concrete, real-world examples to prove exactly where it's failing.

The rest of the squad basically has their spotlights aimed directly at the instructors. 🙂

I know I’m going to get crucified by every teacher on this forum for saying this, but I honestly have more respect for the students who act out externally than those who suffer in silence. One group is practically screaming "help me" through their behavior, while the other just shuts down entirely. It’s a tragedy when that plea for help goes unnoticed.

I am convinced there are effective ways to ensure even those who refuse to raise their voices are finally noticed. 🤔
As for those who manifest their disorders through outward aggression, there is such a staggering level of incompetence that one is left speechless. When you have a student who sets fire to a trash can in class one day, throws tear gas the next, and spits in another kid's sandwich the third, you are simply paralyzed—especially if you are just starting out in this profession.
It is my firm belief that someone should have intervened with kids like that long before they even reached middle school.

The second breed of parent I’ve encountered is the "pseudo-expert" who thinks they’re a licensed pediatrician. No offense to anyone who actually earned their credentials—there are exceptions—but from what I’ve seen, these self-proclaimed gurus are absolutely exhausting.
The pressure placed on a child to be "above average" simply because their parents claim to be "above average" is nothing short of psychological tyranny. It is an absurd standard that treats children like corporate assets rather than human beings.
It’s absolutely infuriating what is happening. These kids are being systematically bullied at home with all sorts of toxic influences, and then they burst into school like a powder keg ready to explode.

I have to admit, I’ve never encountered anything quite like this. It’s pathetic, honestly—those poor kids.

When you don't actually want to solve a problem—well, you just form a commission. It’s the same logic as saying, "if you don't want to deal with the actual complexities of an issue, just blame the system" 😁.

Claiming "the system is broken" provides nothing more than a superficial consensus: essentially, it’s a way to relegate the problem to the realm of the unsolvable. The system is at fault, and what can we possibly do about it? "The system"—that’s just "them." By dividing everything into "us" versus "them," the system becomes this nebulous (and frankly, non-existent) entity that is, by definition, malicious, incompetent, and foolish.

As long as we avoid the direct question regarding whether there are certain educators who should be banned from teaching altogether today, none of the "educators participating in this thread" will acknowledge that elementary fact—if anyone actually stated that, I sincerely apologize, as I don't recall seeing such a sentence—and presumably, teachers are a vital component of the system. Therefore, this agreement that the system is failing is nothing more than selling smoke.

On the other hand, "the rest of the group" (there goes that "us" vs "them" mentality again) unanimously confirms the existence of idiot parents in all their various guises: ranging from the aggressive idiot to the hyper-ambitious idiot.

Jessica Howard5 said:I’ve noticed something else, and I know it’s true because I have three kids and all three of them bring it up. I remember seeing it during my own school years, too. There are teachers out there who just don't play fair when it comes to grading. You've got some instructors who are incredibly strict and rigid with certain students, yet they have a handful of little favorites they constantly let slide—acting like nobody notices. What’s the reality from your side? Parents, what have you seen? And teachers, be honest: do you actually have those "golden children" you're willing to forgive everything for, while punishing someone else for the exact same mistake?

A huge chunk of grades is earned through written tests—meaning the grade is just a direct result of points accumulated, which doesn't really leave much room for favoritism. Now, when we're talking about oral exams, I suppose a student isn't exactly qualified to judge the quality of their own response—or anyone else's, for that matter.

There’s also another layer to this: it’s practically impossible to accurately capture the knowledge level of thirty different students using only five available grades, nor is there any human being capable of grading thirty people without making mistakes. A rule that really should be standard—though I doubt many in the American education system actually follow it—is "when in doubt, give the benefit of the doubt to the student." That way, at least this inevitable subjectivity doesn't end up unfairly penalizing the kids.

As for this whole "teacher's pet" narrative, I'm sure there's a grain of truth to it—but I honestly believe most of it is just a mix of urban legends, childhood bias, and the simple fact that if you're an unpopular kid armed with a failing grade, it’s incredibly easy for people to slap the "teacher's pet" label on you.

I was definitely one of those students my elementary school teachers absolutely adored. That said, I wasn't exactly a star pupil once I hit the later grades; I was actually pretty far from the typical "teacher's pet" archetype.
For some reason, though, they just found me likable and were willing to let things slide for me—something they certainly didn't do for everyone else.
Oh, and back in high school, I had this one chemistry teacher who actually helped me wrap up a problem on my final exam. She just really liked my spirit—she thought it was endearing that someone with zero natural talent worked as hard as I did.
I'm still not quite sure why my elementary teachers took such a shine to me, but I know I got away with much more than my classmates did.

Teachers always dig up some excuse for why something can't be done, and then they act completely blindsided when people start looking at them sideways. They wonder why they have zero respect left—and no, the answer isn't their paycheck.

My kid’s 6th-grade teacher just rolled out this new way of talking to the kids during homeroom. Basically, if a problem pops up, he hands out paper and pencils and asks them to write down their side of the story anonymously. They drop the notes into a box he built himself—looks just like a ballot box at a polling station. He ended up getting 28 written responses for one specific issue. At the parent meeting, he claimed the kids are mostly honest and tell the truth. Since he gets a statistically accurate answer to his questions, he figures most of them are being sincere. It gives him better insight so he can handle things more effectively. If it turns out to be one student acting up or a specific group, he calls them into his office during a long recess to confront them with the facts. He says it’s working great for resolving conflicts. What do you all think about this approach?

Nicholas King said:When you don't actually want to solve a problem—well, you just form a commission. It’s the same logic as saying, "if you don't want to deal with the actual complexities of an issue, just blame the system" 😁.

Claiming "the system is broken" provides nothing more than a superficial consensus: essentially, it’s a way to relegate the problem to the realm of the unsolvable. The system is at fault, and what can we possibly do about it? "The system"—that’s just "them." By dividing everything into "us" versus "them," the system becomes this nebulous (and frankly, non-existent) entity that is, by definition, malicious, incompetent, and foolish.

As long as we avoid the direct question regarding whether there are certain educators who should be banned from teaching altogether today, none of the "educators participating in this thread" will acknowledge that elementary fact—if anyone actually stated that, I sincerely apologize, as I don't recall seeing such a sentence—and presumably, teachers are a vital component of the system. Therefore, this agreement that the system is failing is nothing more than selling smoke.

On the other hand, "the rest of the group" (there goes that "us" vs "them" mentality again) unanimously confirms the existence of idiot parents in all their various guises: ranging from the aggressive idiot to the hyper-ambitious idiot.

It's an obvious truth, and I agree. It happens in every corner of society, including education. Whenever someone doesn't want to put in the actual work to solve a problem, they blame the system. Who's to blame when we're too lazy to leave a paper trail? In my corporate job, I'm used to having to write a report for every damn thing, and I always communicate with my director via email or formal memo. That way, there's no "he said, she said." I think that's the solution for schools, too. Start leaving a written record so people actually take you seriously. I dealt with something similar regarding a construction project. To make a long story short, they kept bouncing me between the Department of City Planning, the deed office, the land registry, and building inspectors. I was wandering aimlessly through the bureaucracy until I started submitting formal written requests and officially logging them, even setting deadlines for responses within those documents. Once I gathered everything, I sent it straight to the Department of Housing and Urban Development. They were stunned that their own system actually functions like that when dealing with someone trying to build a house. Eventually, they had to give me a formal response with strict instructions on which institutions to contact and which permits to pull. The whole thing took three months, but if I had just "accepted" the system, I would have never solved it. My advice? Use written communication within the system to avoid the confusion.

As for grading, my daughter actually took a hit back in high school because her class had so many students she couldn't get a chance to raise her grade. She ended up stuck with a B. It was Chemistry—she was right on the edge between a C and a B—and when she finally stepped up to answer a question to boost her mark, the teacher told her right in front of everyone, "I can ask you, but then I’m taking time away from someone who needs to fix a failing grade, so if they agree, I'll call on you." My girl just sat back down and said, fine, let them fix their grades. Same exact thing happened with Music Appreciation. You won't believe this, but out of the first eight grades, not a single kid had an A in music. There were endless retakes and a sea of Cs and Ds. I think there were maybe fifteen Bs total out of 200 students?! And this was at a top-tier magnet school in Indianapolis. What kind of ridiculous subject is Music Appreciation anyway? When she explained how the tests worked, I told her that the C she got is actually a win and she shouldn't stress about music for the rest of her life. Personally, I can barely recognize myself in a mirror, so I'm doing just fine, hahaha.

Jessica Howard5 said:As for grading, my daughter actually took a hit back in high school because her class had so many students she couldn't get a chance to raise her grade. She ended up stuck with a B. It was Chemistry—she was right on the edge between a C and a B—and when she finally stepped up to answer a question to boost her mark, the teacher told her right in front of everyone, "I can ask you, but then I’m taking time away from someone who needs to fix a failing grade, so if they agree, I'll call on you." My girl just sat back down and said, fine, let them fix their grades. Same exact thing happened with Music Appreciation. You won't believe this, but out of the first eight grades, not a single kid had an A in music. There were endless retakes and a sea of Cs and Ds. I think there were maybe fifteen Bs total out of 200 students?! And this was at a top-tier magnet school in Indianapolis. What kind of ridiculous subject is Music Appreciation anyway? When she explained how the tests worked, I told her that the C she got is actually a win and she shouldn't stress about music for the rest of her life. Personally, I can barely recognize myself in a mirror, so I'm doing just fine, hahaha.

"Grade inflation"—trying to artificially boost an average—is anything but a desirable or acceptable practice. Students who, at the very last second, pressure their teachers to "bump them up" lose, to put it mildly, any credibility when they demand order and accountability within the school system. And that goes for the parents involved as well.

I told her that a C is actually a great grade and that she shouldn't stress herself out over music appreciation in her actual life. I mean, I only ever saw Era from that other world and barely even that, so I’m not missing out on anything hahahaha.

This kind of disdain toward music—or indeed, any form of culture (in a life sense, not just as a school subject)—is honestly quite pathetic. Reducing life down to just being, existing, and whatever else essentially disqualifies someone from engaging in serious discussions about matters far more significant than the flaws in our entire educational system.

To be blunt (and perhaps unpopular), it isn't true that you "aren't missing anything." The sheer volume of grammatical errors in your posts significantly undermines your authority when discussing what schools should look like: ranging from the fact that the old-school systems (which you claim were better) produced people with these specific writing struggles, to the fact that you view linguistic literacy (much like any other culture) as irrelevant, clearly showing you don't care about the basic form through which you present your own arguments.

If writing and literacy are truly unimportant, then—following that exact same logic—our current school system is doing just super-duper.