Why did Jesus die?

Alex Ramos91 said:🤣 😂

The part in Luke's Gospel that says "He went down with them and came to Nazareth and was obedient to them" refers to when he was just a kid...

That’s pretty much the last thing we hear about his home life before he actually started his public ministry...
Look, this is clearly talking about his childhood. Even though He was perfect, He didn't have any issue submitting to His imperfect parents and showing them respect while growing up. 👍

But once He grew up? It was a totally different story. He made it crystal clear to Mary when she tried to step in and micromanage His work: "Lady, what does that have to do with me?" 😛

Are we talking about a biography here? I mean, he was born, sure, but we don't even know the exact time or place.

There isn't really any data provided leading up to that moment at the Temple when he was twelve, right?

And then there's just this massive gap between age twelve and thirty.

Based on the Gospels, we're looking at events that spanned either one year or three years. We don't even have an exact date for when Jesus was crucified. The timing is mostly just inferred from quotes mentioning it happened during the era of Pontius Pilate and Tiberius.

I guess that's why there are so many different theories about Jesus. Since we only have these specific fragments, it feels like you could reach almost any conclusion depending on how you interpret the gaps.

Quiet! It was God's will! If He wanted everything documented with absolute precision, He would have simply possessed Pliny the Elder and forced him to write it all down, instead of relying on these half-educated types... 😁

Peter Martin said:Quiet! It was God's will! If He wanted everything documented with absolute precision, He would have simply possessed Pliny the Elder and forced him to write it all down, instead of relying on these half-educated types... 😁

He swallowed Saul, and honestly, that was more than enough to ensure his Morbus sacer wrote exactly what needed to be written.

If anyone actually takes the time to dig through the archives and hunt down what was written regarding how Jesus grew up and what he taught, you'll find they didn't manage to burn every single scrap of evidence.

I’m trying to wrap my head around how God can die and then just come back to life and...

In Christian belief, is Jesus actually God, or is he just the son, or what exactly is the deal?

Please keep your answers brief, if you wouldn't mind and if you actually have the time to get back to me.

William Williams7 said:I’m trying to wrap my head around how God can die and then just come back to life and...

In Christian belief, is Jesus actually God, or is he just the son, or what exactly is the deal?

Please keep your answers brief, if you wouldn't mind and if you actually have the time to get back to me.

The Bible is pretty clear—Jesus died "in spirit," meaning he didn't actually die. He just left his physical body behind. "He died in the body, but through his spirit, he descended into the underworld to preach the gospel to the spirits who were disobedient during the days of Noah..."

So, during those three days of "death," Jesus was still spiritually active—preaching, teaching, all that..

Is Jesus God according to Christian belief, or is he the son, or what?

Christ is God because of how He operates through the Holy Spirit. Scripture makes it obvious: everything was created through Him, and everything that exists draws its existence from Him.

He's the son because He manifested from the Father as the only begotten—the one single manifestation from the Nutrine. That’s why He's subordinate to the Father, just like the Father is subordinate to the Holy Spirit. When God-Holy Spirit decided to create, He first gave Himself the form of Father and Son so that everything created could be "in the image and likeness" of the manifested deity of the Father and Son.

.

Could you please give me short answers if you have the time to respond?

Then you be polite too—stop assuming the Christian God can die or that God can't "give birth." Some people think that's impossible because they follow the logic that "Allah has no wife." Can you believe how shallow that kind of reasoning is!?

His soul just slipped out for a second to go down to hell and clean things up, then popped back into his body to head home to his heavenly Father.
What’s the deal with ancient Egyptian religion, though? Basically, when a pharaoh dies, they bury him, the soul finds its way back to the body, and on that long trek to reunite with God, he has to pass through hell, face some judgment—where things might get a little dicey depending on how he played it—and eventually merge with Ra.

I mean, he had to die for us to find salvation through faith, right? But could you actually believe in a God who got married and ended up having three kids and all that?

ruggedridge45 said:I mean, he had to die for us to find salvation through faith, right? But could you actually believe in a God who got married and ended up having three kids and all that?

It probably would’ve been more impactful if he had wings. Maybe then the faith would be even stronger.

I’d love to hear from my fellow Christians on this one:
If we accept the idea that Jesus had to be crucified and die on the cross because it was ultimately God's will, then why would God use His power to tear the temple veil apart as a sign of His fury following the death of His Son?
It feels like a contradiction. If Jesus was destined to be crucified—essentially stepping into the line of fire to absorb God's wrath—then the Sanhedrin wasn't really the "villain" behind his death. In that light, they were just another link in the chain of events required to fulfill the prophecy.

Ethan Gonzalez2 said:I’d love to hear from my fellow Christians on this one:
If we accept the idea that Jesus had to be crucified and die on the cross because it was ultimately God's will, then why would God use His power to tear the temple veil apart as a sign of His fury following the death of His Son?
It feels like a contradiction. If Jesus was destined to be crucified—essentially stepping into the line of fire to absorb God's wrath—then the Sanhedrin wasn't really the "villain" behind his death. In that light, they were just another link in the chain of events required to fulfill the prophecy.

Man, you shouldn't have asked all Christians. I'm a believer myself, but I honestly don't have a clue about this stuff. So, my answer as a Christian basically amounts to nothing. Here's some advice though: go check out the threads on the Trinity, do some reading, and maybe you'll find what you're actually looking for. Peace!

Ethan Gonzalez2 said:I’d love to hear from my fellow Christians on this one:
If we accept the idea that Jesus had to be crucified and die on the cross because it was ultimately God's will, then why would God use His power to tear the temple veil apart as a sign of His fury following the death of His Son?
It feels like a contradiction. If Jesus was destined to be crucified—essentially stepping into the line of fire to absorb God's wrath—then the Sanhedrin wasn't really the "villain" behind his death. In that light, they were just another link in the chain of events required to fulfill the prophecy.

That curtain served as the barrier in the Temple, separating the area where the Levite priests performed their duties from the Holy of Holies—the place where the Ark of the Covenant sat and where God’s presence actually resided. It was intense. Just once a year, on the Day of Reconciliation, the High Priest alone could step through that veil, carrying the sacrificial blood to atone for the people's sins and carry out the ritual of atonement.

Look, people keep getting this wrong. When that curtain ripped apart at the moment Jesus died, it wasn't some sign that God was throwing a temper tantrum. It wasn't about divine wrath. It’s actually the exact opposite. That tear was a symbol—it showed that one single, perfect sacrifice had been made for our sins. The path to the Holy of Holies is wide open now. It's not like before, where only the High Priest could step into God's presence. Now? Anyone who comes to God through Christ's blood has a direct line. It's open to everyone. Period.

It’s all right there in the book of Hebrews, chapter 10:
Look, brothers, here’s the reality: we have total, unrestricted access to the Holy of Holies because of Jesus' blood. It’s not some gatekept ritual anymore. He tore through that curtain—His own body—to carve out this new, living path for us. We’ve got a High Priest overseeing God's house now, so the old barriers are gone. This means we need to show up with a sincere heart and full-blown faith. No faking it. We need our hearts cleansed from a guilty conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. Let's actually live like it.

Ethan Gonzalez2 said:I’d love to hear from my fellow Christians on this one:
If we accept the idea that Jesus had to be crucified and die on the cross because it was ultimately God's will, then why would God use His power to tear the temple veil apart as a sign of His fury following the death of His Son?
It feels like a contradiction. If Jesus was destined to be crucified—essentially stepping into the line of fire to absorb God's wrath—then the Sanhedrin wasn't really the "villain" behind his death. In that light, they were just another link in the chain of events required to fulfill the prophecy.

Now we’re getting into deep philosophical territory—it’s like that whole mess with Judah betraying Jesus under the influence of Satan, where Jesus tells him he’d have been better off never being born in the first place.
It’s obvious that God, in His infinite omniscience, already knows exactly how any given person is going to choose. What really blows my mind, though, is how God has this incredible ability to take our absolute worst decisions and somehow twist them into something good—even if we still have to own up to our own actions and consequences.

Thanks from my side too, I just learned something really beautiful about my faith. Like, truly beautiful... no more bloodshed.

Alex Ramos91 said:That curtain served as the barrier in the Temple, separating the area where the Levite priests performed their duties from the Holy of Holies—the place where the Ark of the Covenant sat and where God’s presence actually resided. It was intense. Just once a year, on the Day of Reconciliation, the High Priest alone could step through that veil, carrying the sacrificial blood to atone for the people's sins and carry out the ritual of atonement.

Look, people keep getting this wrong. When that curtain ripped apart at the moment Jesus died, it wasn't some sign that God was throwing a temper tantrum. It wasn't about divine wrath. It’s actually the exact opposite. That tear was a symbol—it showed that one single, perfect sacrifice had been made for our sins. The path to the Holy of Holies is wide open now. It's not like before, where only the High Priest could step into God's presence. Now? Anyone who comes to God through Christ's blood has a direct line. It's open to everyone. Period.

It’s all right there in the book of Hebrews, chapter 10:
Look, brothers, here’s the reality: we have total, unrestricted access to the Holy of Holies because of Jesus' blood. It’s not some gatekept ritual anymore. He tore through that curtain—His own body—to carve out this new, living path for us. We’ve got a High Priest overseeing God's house now, so the old barriers are gone. This means we need to show up with a sincere heart and full-blown faith. No faking it. We need our hearts cleansed from a guilty conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. Let's actually live like it.

Now we’re getting into deep philosophical territory—it’s like that whole mess with Judah betraying Jesus under the influence of Satan, where Jesus tells him he’d have been better off never being born in the first place.
It’s obvious that God, in His infinite omniscience, already knows exactly how any given person is going to choose. What really blows my mind, though, is how God has this incredible ability to take our absolute worst decisions and somehow twist them into something good—even if we still have to own up to our own actions and consequences.

That’s just some Greek invention. You won't find stories like that among the Jews at all. I mean, they would have noticed, right? It's like if someone tripped and smashed a statue of Saint Helen in Saint Peter's Cathedral and nobody heard a peep or saw a thing.

So you still haven't explained the three hours of darkness covering the world and the earthquake happening the moment Jesus died on the cross.
Isn't that just God's wrath hitting those who killed His Son?
(Not that God doesn't lose His temper plenty of times in the Bible)

What's the symbol behind those three hours of darkness? (Since nobody seems to have recorded it anywhere else)

it wasn't an expression of God's anger, but a symbol

Nah. That was just the Greeks trying to say God wasn't on the side of the Jews anymore, but had shifted toward the Greeks—basically, Christians. They changed the theology. Scrapped the old one and wrote a New Testament.

*

Though, I gotta admit, I dig the idea of the "torn curtain" symbolizing the end of separation. The Being behind the curtain, which used to communicate only with priests, finally opening up to everyone. But that's just poetic license. Priests have always been the ones "hiding behind the curtain," kind of like the Wizard of Oz. Once the curtain gets ripped away, you just see some balding guy, even though until then, you were hearing the mighty voice of Jehovah....

The Shekinah is like a veil draped between humanity and the heavens.
In ancient times, this was symbolized within the temple; once that veil was lifted, the Divine became accessible to everyone—not just the elite, but the common person too. However, it didn't take long for a new veil to be drawn by the Catholic Church, which I would describe as a thick fog, obscuring the ability to perceive God through one's inner eye.
I see a parallel between this heavy mist and the Shekinah as it existed before the dawn of creation, when a shroud of fog rested over the earth above the primordial waters.
The light has yet to break through...

velvetmaker39 said:First off, hello. I’d say we’re dealing with adults here, though I find myself wondering where exactly these people have been living all this time—where they went to school, or if they’ve ever actually sat down to contemplate the nature of existence at all. It seems everyone here takes everything so incredibly literally, whereas all those sacred texts were written using allegory; you really need to exercise a bit of imagination and, frankly, quite a lot of wisdom to process what’s written on those pages. It’s a mistake to jump into an argument when your understanding of life is so fundamentally grounded in the mundane. Before anything else, one has to consider WHO was actually writing and transmitting this TRUTH. After all, aren't we all witnesses to the fact that people write everything from simple short stories to doctoral dissertations that might not have any bearing on actual reality? If someone wants to understand life and debate its meaning, they should perhaps start by reading George Orwell’s *Animal Farm*; once they grasp what the author was trying to convey there, they won't find it such a monumental task to decipher the so-called Holy Scripture. The question of who decided which writings would be deemed Holy and which would not is absolutely paramount. To simply accept something as truth just because it was imposed upon us by tyrants and butchers—well, you have to admit, that’s pretty foolish (though I suppose some folks here feel right at home with that approach, likely doing the exact same thing today under the guise of FAITH). First, we are presented with the TEN COMMANDMENTS that God gave to Moses, yet somehow, look at that, "Thou shalt not kill" doesn't show up until the fifth spot, does it? Perhaps someone swapped the tablets, or maybe we just haven't considered which side one is supposed to start reading from (since some read left to right and others right to left). There is so much more to be said about what is written in the words of the PROPHET. In the Quran, it says that if you harm one person, you have harmed God. For anyone with half a brain, that’s plenty; yet later it suggests stoning a man. I’d love to know if the enlightened Muhammad actually said something that contradicts his own initial teaching. I find it hard to believe; he was truly an enlightened man. It would be reasonable to be able to accept what you think is right while rejecting the chaff from the wheat, but is it truly rational to believe everything handed down to you by someone who doesn't even possess a peaceful conscience? I’m thinking specifically of Paul, who was a persecutor before he wasn't, and who largely drives the modern interpretation of the Bible. It would be lovely if thinking people applied a little critical thought to their own beliefs first; I’m not saying anyone shouldn't believe, because a believer believes, and others believe too.

I found this post really interesting because it suggests we take everything too literally. He’s implying that these texts are allegories. But, I guess, couldn't we argue the exact opposite?

The texts were written by simple people, or perhaps the traditions were dreamed up by poor, uneducated folks. Generally speaking, they weren't highly schooled. And these texts were directed toward people who were also poorly educated, simple, and impoverished. Why on earth would they write these texts in codes or riddles that even the most educated scholar wouldn't be able to decipher?

That’s why I think the texts should actually be taken literally.

I've spent some time digging through a couple of different sites, but I honestly haven't been able to find a straight answer to the main question here: Why did Jesus die? And I don't mean the theological explanation—I'm looking for something else.

Taylor Reyes3 said:I’m simply pointing out what Jesus told His disciples, which they recorded for us, the future generations, to teach us how to earn our place in God's kingdom.
Later in the scriptures, Jesus makes it clear that no one comes to the Father except through Him.
The New Testament was written specifically for those of us coming after, while the Old Testament focuses on the era before His birth. That’s why God sent His Son, because back then, nobody was really listening to the prophets.

Honestly, I find it hard to believe that believers weren't listening to the prophets. If you really sit down and think about it, I guess we have to conclude that it’s almost impossible that Jews weren't paying attention to their own prophets.

It feels more likely that we're looking at a Christian interpretation of the Old Testament here.

Nicholas Edwards10 said:Jesus didn't just die; He was taken up... And mark my words, He’s coming back down 😉

The core argument here is that He ascended to heaven—that He had a physical body, endured suffering and torture, was ultimately crucified, and then, after three days, rose again into eternal life.

I think the best way to wrap our heads around this is by looking at the story of how Lazarus was brought back to life.

But we really have to start with the Jewish concept of resurrection. Jews believed, and still believe, in the resurrection of the dead. However, their view is that this will happen all at once one day, when everyone who lived and died for God will be raised for eternal life.

See, there's a distinction to be made here. When Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead, He brought him back to life, sure, but Lazarus is just going to go back to living his life like anyone else, which means he'll eventually pass away again. In the Jewish tradition, people believe they will essentially sleep in the dust of the earth. Then, one day, God will perform a miracle and all the true believers will rise from that earthly dust to begin their eternal lives.

So, I guess you could say Jesus and His specific resurrection were essentially a "new release" in the faith; it wasn't really part of the Jewish religious framework before Him. Because Jesus died and rose to eternal life ahead of everyone else—who are all still waiting for that final, collective resurrection of all believers.

Gregory Jackson said:I guess one of his main goals was basically setting up a new faith that would stay close to the truth and guide people toward more positive thoughts and actions—though how successful that actually was is probably a whole different conversation—which would eventually lift human consciousness to a higher level. At one point during his mission, Palestine was totally split between those for him and those against him. Or, like, how Jesus put it—the father against the son, the daughter against the mother—and there was this real threat of a massive civil war breaking out, which probably would have just wiped out the few active followers left and shut down the whole movement before it even got going. So, maybe it was necessary for his life on Earth to reach the end of the world, because instead of just leaving behind a living leader who could be physically taken out, he created this legend that's impossible to destroy, and honestly, its impact ends up being way more effective than any living leader could ever be. Things like the resurrection, the earthquake, and the darkening of the Sun during the crucifixion, plus the way he appeared to his disciples later on, all helped build up that mystique and confirmed everything he always claimed—that he is God's son. Once that legend took hold, it just couldn't be stopped, and with the help of the Holy Spirit, the apostles spread this new religion everywhere, which likely wouldn't have happened if they had been caught up in a violent civil war.

I think I might interpret that a bit differently.

The Gospels are texts from the New Testament. And that "new religion" being discussed is Christianity.

But while Jesus was still alive, Christianity didn't really exist yet. It was just the Old Testament, or as the letters say.

The real question is, how did we actually get from a Jewish religion to Christianity?