All-day school schedules

Here’s the breakdown of the changes.

I find myself nodding along with this sentiment.
It feels like a much-needed shift toward balance, ensuring elementary teachers carry a workload comparable to subject specialists, all while maintaining the invaluable advantage of working with small, intimate classes of about twenty students rather than being thrown into massive lecture halls of 120 to 300 kids depending on the schedule.

Susan James said:Just a quick update: the public comment period closed on April 6, 2023, and we’re expecting the final report to be released around May 5, 2023.
While I wouldn't be surprised if the response to nearly 3,000 comments ends up being a polite "thanks, we'll take it under advisement," it’s pretty glaring that the deadline for school district applications is set for April 28, 2023.
It looks like they're moving forward with those 25% salary increases regardless of what the massive pool of experts across the country thinks, or whether any actual changes come out of these consultations.🙏

I heard somewhere that they extended the application window—not sure how long though.

Wait, were there really not even 50 principals out there willing to step up and apply? I mean, honestly... what a joke.

Sarah Hall53 said:Wait, were there really not even 50 principals out there willing to step up and apply? I mean, honestly... what a joke.

Now everyone is going to jump on this:

The fixed 4.5% stipend for all staff in the Pilot Program is being bumped up to 5%.

Homeroom teacher stipends are increasing to 5%, up from the previous 2.5%. Every teacher will receive a 5% bonus based on their base salary for each hour spent as a homeroom advisor.

🎉🎉🎉

So, instead of hitting that 10% benchmark, I was looking at what the grade level totals have actually been up to this point... and honestly? They basically just hit you with a -5% penalty.

wanderingbadger44 said:I find myself nodding along with this sentiment.
It feels like a much-needed shift toward balance, ensuring elementary teachers carry a workload comparable to subject specialists, all while maintaining the invaluable advantage of working with small, intimate classes of about twenty students rather than being thrown into massive lecture halls of 120 to 300 kids depending on the schedule.

Generally, I wouldn't want to pile more onto any teacher than they already have. You can't work with kids if you're burnt out. Finn understood that perfectly.
Just look at how much they're going to load up the history and math departments.

jadetinker85 said:Generally, I wouldn't want to pile more onto any teacher than they already have. You can't work with kids if you're burnt out. Finn understood that perfectly.
Just look at how much they're going to load up the history and math departments.

And I suppose surgeons and other doctors don't need rest? They can just work shifts and call it even? 😵

Drew Gonzalez75 said:And I suppose surgeons and other doctors don't need rest? They can just work shifts and call it even? 😵

What are you even talking about? I’m definitely not on board with single-shift schooling, and there are plenty of reasons why. It messes with everything—from how local music schools and youth sports leagues operate, to parents working afternoon shifts who'll barely see their kids until the weekend.

But honestly, if you’re stuck teaching math or English, you’re looking at an obligatory 24 hours in the classroom—and then, if the principal feels like being extra, they might tack on some homeroom duties too (for basically peanuts), not to mention all the B1 stuff. Plus, there's the endless mountain of grading essays, formative assessments, and all those other paperwork headaches that come with the territory. It feels like every single year, these administrative tasks multiply faster than anything else—honestly, even rats have more discipline when it comes to staying organized than this school system does when it comes to multiplying its own bureaucracy. And hey, why stop there? Let's just have teachers stay through the night shift to handle student counseling, too. That sounds like a brilliant plan, right? Because, clearly, we're all being paid on par with neurosurgeons. ☕

All this arguing isn't helping anyone, and honestly, things are just how they are.
Specialists should be handling specialized roles, while classroom teachers should probably be putting in double the effort since they get so much downtime. As for those working in government bureaucracy, maybe now they’ll finally settle into a standard 40-hour week without all those extra days off. If we applied private sector standards to public employees, they'd be on minimum wage, doing nothing, yet still getting breaks and vacation time—and $2000 even then, it would be too much.
🙂
We really are stuck with our own way of thinking.

jadetinker85 said:What are you even talking about? I’m definitely not on board with single-shift schooling, and there are plenty of reasons why. It messes with everything—from how local music schools and youth sports leagues operate, to parents working afternoon shifts who'll barely see their kids until the weekend.

Well, personally, I think a single-shift schedule might actually be better for my kid, mostly because of their sports commitments.

mellowskipper said:Well, personally, I think a single-shift schedule might actually be better for my kid, mostly because of their sports commitments.

Look, there’s just no logic to it. If everyone switched to private sessions, we'd run out of space instantly. There wouldn't be enough fields, pool lanes, or coaches to handle everyone at once.
Think about it. You have two soccer fields—how are you supposed to train the U-10s, the U-14s, the high schoolers, and the varsity kids all at the exact same time? Or take a few tennis courts: how do you manage 20 players simultaneously when they used to have staggered schedules throughout the day? Even with an ice rink, you can't just cram every group that used to use the morning and afternoon slots onto the ice all at once.

A lot of sports are only scheduled for the afternoon, which is why Sky Sports carries them.
My little girl only has availability in the afternoons too, so when school runs late, she ends up missing her practice.

rowdypanther12 said:A lot of sports are only scheduled for the afternoon, which is why Sky Sports carries them.
My little girl only has availability in the afternoons too, so when school runs late, she ends up missing her practice.

But then again, plenty of sports aren't limited to just the afternoons. Swimming isn't, water polo isn't, soccer isn't, tennis isn't... I'll have to check how skating works... usually offered in both shifts. https://www.usahockey.com/schedule/
Ice hockey is the same story.

jadetinker85 said:Generally, I wouldn't want to pile more onto any teacher than they already have. You can't work with kids if you're burnt out. Finn understood that perfectly.
Just look at how much they're going to load up the history and math departments.

Honestly, I’m disgusted. I teach math—hourly contract, too—and even though I’m not that far from retirement, I’m seriously considering retraining and just getting out of education entirely. Math teachers have always been overworked as it is, regardless of having a slightly lighter load. Between the endless piles of tests that require actual focus to grade, the mandatory overtime, and the constant retakes... it's a lot. If this actually happens, who is even going to be qualified to teach math? My guess? Nobody.

Most kids are already stuck in a single-shift schedule:
"While roughly one-third of schools in America operate on split shifts, nearly two-thirds of all students actually attend them." Or am I looking at different statistics here?

The ultimate goal—from as far back as I can remember—has been to get everyone onto a single-shift schedule, regardless of whether we implement full-day schooling or not. And if you ask any student or parent currently dealing with split shifts, I’d bet my bottom dollar most of them hate it—it’s a logistical nightmare. If parents aren't home in the morning, extracurriculars have to be pushed to the evening, which they rarely are. Plus, given how the youth population is shrinking, while the number of schools and teachers is actually rising, moving toward a single shift is clearly where we're headed.

So, honestly, this whole debate about split shifts is a total red herring when it comes to this specific topic (full-day instruction).

mistydrifter73 said:Found this in a Facebook group. These were some choice words from Josip Burušić (the special advisor to the Secretary of Education regarding all-day schooling) at a meeting for CDŠ in San Francisco:

"...there’s been way too much laziness."
"If you enjoyed yourselves, then fine, you enjoyed yourselves..."
"Things have been easy for you long enough; it's about time you actually started doing something."
"I honestly don't know why you guys even get a paycheck. If it were up to me, I wouldn't give you a dime."
"Teachers have gotten used to coasting, and now that they actually need to work, suddenly it's an issue."
"The only people showing up to the public forums are the ones who aren't working. I personally checked their teaching hours to see for myself."

Nothing beats feeling like your hard work is actually recognized. 🎉 😍

Absolutely disgraceful. Based on such low-level remarks alone, this "highly esteemed" special advisor to the Department should be forced to resign. Watch this guy—he was actually checking who participated in the public forum, apparently? Is he trying to import some old-school habits from his hometown into America? Or is this just the standard operating procedure for the Republican Party?

ironjackal said:Most kids are already stuck in a single-shift schedule:
"While roughly one-third of schools in America operate on split shifts, nearly two-thirds of all students actually attend them." Or am I looking at different statistics here?

The ultimate goal—from as far back as I can remember—has been to get everyone onto a single-shift schedule, regardless of whether we implement full-day schooling or not. And if you ask any student or parent currently dealing with split shifts, I’d bet my bottom dollar most of them hate it—it’s a logistical nightmare. If parents aren't home in the morning, extracurriculars have to be pushed to the evening, which they rarely are. Plus, given how the youth population is shrinking, while the number of schools and teachers is actually rising, moving toward a single shift is clearly where we're headed.

So, honestly, this whole debate about split shifts is a total red herring when it comes to this specific topic (full-day instruction).

Maybe I’m misreading the data, but if about a third of schools are running split shifts, those campuses are likely packed. You end up with double or even triple the student density compared to single-shift schools. Essentially, a much larger chunk of the student population is dealing with that shift schedule.

The goal should have been single-shift schooling a long time ago—independent of how much instruction happens daily. From what I’ve gathered from students and parents dealing with split shifts, most people hate it. It just doesn't work. If you're on the morning shift, there are no parents around during the day to help out, which means any extracurriculars or activities get pushed to the evening. You almost never see anything scheduled in the morning. And given how much the birth rate is dropping across the country... The number of schools and teachers has climbed, too.That’s definitely where things are headed.

So, the whole thing about shifts has nothing to do with this topic (the all-day sessions).

It’s a massive range of jobs. You've got the service sector—hospitality, tourism, retail—where afternoon shifts are standard. Then you move into essential services like doctors, pharmacists, dentists, police officers, and firefighters, where shift work isn't just common, it's the rule.

frozenangler9 said:Honestly, I’m disgusted. I teach math—hourly contract, too—and even though I’m not that far from retirement, I’m seriously considering retraining and just getting out of education entirely. Math teachers have always been overworked as it is, regardless of having a slightly lighter load. Between the endless piles of tests that require actual focus to grade, the mandatory overtime, and the constant retakes... it's a lot. If this actually happens, who is even going to be qualified to teach math? My guess? Nobody.

If they want to bury Americans and math teachers under this kind of workload, they should go ahead and cut the number of exams, assignments, readings, essays, presentations, and projects that need reviewing.
How can Americans and math teachers be expected to carry the same or more hours than subjects where you don't even have to grade written work?