Soul and Spirit

Tyler Scott3 said:The soul occupies the entire body, fighting to maintain control over the heart, which acts as the ruler within.
As a person evolves spiritually, the soul shifts; it vacates the throne of the heart to allow the spirit to take command.
Jesus was pure spirit. It was as if his soul barely existed.
When God reveals Himself to a person, it happens through the heart. For this to be possible, the heart must be pure.

Your definitions of soul and spirit are accurate, but ultimately, everything hinges on what you believe and how you practice that belief.

Dragan said:That's an interesting take.

The whole thread is pretty fascinating, honestly.

God, the Holy Spirit, and the Soul—these are three distinct manifestations within the spiritual realm.

If you're coming at this from a strictly materialistic standpoint, you probably shouldn't bother reading any further.

Depending on how you look at things—and different teachers or schools will offer their own specific definitions and categorizations—it all really comes down to the student's capacity to grasp these concepts.

Based on how deep someone's studies go, it’s actually quite common for these three terms to get mixed up—you know, when someone mistakenly equates God with the soul or the spirit.

From a spiritual perspective, while these three phenomena are essentially one, there are definitely distinctions to be made.

Anyway, I'll do my best to break it down:

The Soul is what animates a living being.

The Spirit animates the entire universe.

And all of this is made possible by God.

God is the master of both soul and spirit.

So, now we've established that breath equals spirit.

In other words, whoever consecrates their breath finds themselves enjoying the Holy Spirit.

As for Tyler Scott3:

Any breath—any inhale or exhale—that isn't used to remember or recite the holy name of God Allah HU, is simply wasted breath.

Dragan said:It somehow seems logical to me that the soul, and maybe even what we call the spirit, are still material (= prakriti), no matter how subtle that matter (or rather, vibration) might be. Only the unmanifested could truly be considered non-material.

I have to disagree—that doesn't quite track for me. Both the soul and the spirit have their material counterparts.
An analogy for the spirit could be the wind; whereas the material mirrors of the soul would be things like intelligence and the mind, for instance.
Without overthinking it too much,
the soul and the spirit are two lower—but nonetheless non-material—attributes of the eternal God.

to die—it’s basically having your 'breath' expired
so, if we look at it through the lens of 'breath'—what actually separates the living from the dead?
the living breathe—the dead (the non-living) simply don't take in breath...

does the fact that 'spirit' and 'soul' are nouns imply they have their own independent existence outside of the mind?

is there such a thing as an 'anima mundi'?
and is there even a need for one?

and right (exactly) 🙂 there is where the Islamic HU comes in—acting just like a breath...

to me, the origins of all these words (everything we've touched on) suggest they are relics of our past,
and today—maybe they're just reflections of our own deep-seated desire for immortality?

now, please don't let the spiritualists get worked up with me—I'm just searching, just like you guys are... I'm merely sharing my thoughts...

A breath that isn't used to remember or speak the holy name of God Allah HU is just a wasted breath.

👍

I'm running out of time here. Just a quick note: we really don't know nearly enough about the soul in general. So feel free to jump in with your own thoughts.

So, we've established that breath equals spirit.

The Islamic RUH.
It ties right back to breathing. There's a lot of symbolism there.🙂

If we’re breaking down the actual definitions of soul and spirit, you're spot on. But at the end of the day, it all comes down to what you believe and how you choose to believe it.

Exactly. Some people won't even admit a soul or spirit exists. But hey, that's why this forum exists—to dive into these kinds of interesting topics.

Look, I don't want the theologians getting bent out of shape with me—I’m just searching, just like you all are. Just stating my thoughts.

As far as I'm concerned, keep commenting. Like I said, we know next to nothing about the soul. Or the spirit, for that matter. So go ahead—you, Dragan, and everyone else—keep trying to grasp the ultimate meaning of it all alongside us.🙂

Besides, Dragan is the one driving this topic, and he isn't even an official believer. So, keep it coming.

Brenda Cook4 said:hey, please don't let the spiritual folks get upset with me here—I'm just searching just like everyone else... I'm simply sharing my own thoughts.

Honestly, if you're getting angry, you probably aren't much of a spiritual person anyway... Love The quote in Your sig ; BlueBird.🙂

"Believe those who are seeking the Truth; doubt those who claim they found it!"
(Andra Gido)

Tyler Scott3 said:Well, I guess this is just what these kinds of fascinating discussions are for.

Does everyone else feel that sense of convergence starting to happen within this thread?
👍

hollowtrucker said:Can everyone else feel the convergence happening in this thread?
👍

That’s exactly what was crossing my mind!
I feel love, here! (or I could say: There is a good spirit here!)
Bahu Tabu 😘

Dragan said:Only things that haven't manifested yet could be classified as immaterial.

Honestly, using terms like "spirit" or "soul" feels like such a clumsy way to try and pin down that unmanifested, immaterial essence.🙂

hollowtrucker said:From a spiritual perspective, these three things are essentially one and the same, even if there are subtle distinctions.

Alright then, I’ll give it my best shot:

The soul is what breathes life into a living being.

Spirit is what animates the entire universe.

And all of this is made possible by God.

God is the master of both soul and spirit.

Let me run it by you again, Ana:

Is a living being part of the universe?

Of course it is.

So, if the soul animates a living being, and the spirit animates the universe—doesn't that mean the spirit also animates the living being (since it's part of that universe)? 😁

Can we even really talk about these two as separate entities at all?

And then, on top of all that, there's God.😁 🙏 🙄

Jason Johnson4 said:Can we even talk about this duo as two separate entities?

Honestly, you don't have to talk about it at all if you don't want to.

It reminds me of when a Japanese visitor comes to the West and simply says:
"...that which you call God, the Soul, or the Mind..."

There’s something so wonderful about simple people. That gentleman was Michio Kushi. He wasn't denying the Truth; he just chose to bypass those endless, circular debates altogether.

Jason Johnson4 said:Would a living being be part of the universe?

I'm intentionally leaning toward a specific way of looking at things—though I'm not really trying to represent any particular school of philosophy or religion.

A living being is essentially the embodiment of an immortal soul. That immortal soul then takes on various forms within this material (and mortal) universe.

It's interesting, though—hardly anyone would actually deny the existence of the spirit.

As far as we know:

Breath=Spirit=RUH=Pneuma=Anima

and I'll go ahead and add one more to that list—Sophia.

Jason Johnson4 said:If the soul animates a living being, and the spirit animates the universe, does the spirit also animate the living being (which is itself a part of the universe)? 😁

Thousands upon thousands of philosophers and saints spent millennia debating, analyzing, and trying to grasp these concepts. There's really no reason for me to try to outdo them or make them look bad.
The soul is the essence of the human; the spirit is the essence of the cosmos; God is the Essence itself.
Humans are constantly immersed in the spirit, yet we don't see it directly.
The soul is in constant communication with us, but we don't hear it clearly.
God is constantly communicating with both the soul and the spirit, so naturally, nobody sees it happening.

I'll say it again: materialists just aren't going to wrap their heads around this.

Can God exist entirely unto Himself? Yes; there's nothing we can do to argue otherwise.
Can the soul survive the total destruction of the universe? It can.
Can the spirit destroy the soul or overshadow God? No, it cannot.

God is the source; the soul is the ocean; the spirit is the current.
Since I tend to avoid technical jargon—and because there honestly aren't enough words (since words are just mental constructs) to fully describe the Truth—I rely on analogies. My apologies to anyone I might confuse or leave feeling like I've missed the mark.

Can God exist entirely unto Himself? He can; there is nothing we can do to change that reality.
Can the soul survive even if the entire universe were wiped off the face of the earth? It can.
Can the spirit destroy the soul or cast a shadow over God? It simply cannot.

God doesn't need anyone else.
Besides, what does "universal destruction" even mean in this context?
The spirit and the soul aren't some superhero duo like Batman and Superman.🤣 🙂

Karen Sanchez19 said:God doesn't have a self

But how can you be so sure? Where exactly have you seen any kind of "self" before?

Look, Karen Sanchez19—believe me when I say the hardest part of all this is grasping that God *does* have a self; that He is a living being—even if that existence is unconditional, indestructible, and transcends everything else.

hollowtrucker said:How can you be so sure? Where have you even seen evidence of such a thing?

Listen, Karen Sanchez19; believe me when I say the hardest pill to swallow is the realization that God exists as a self-contained entity; a living being; though He is unconditional, indestructible, and supreme over all else.

🤣

if that weren't the case, He wouldn't be one😁 nor would He be absolute

everything living has a beginning and an end😁

Karen Sanchez19 said:that wouldn't be one😁 nor would it be absolute

everything living has a beginning and an end😁

Can you see why this is so hard to wrap your head around?

Let's try looking at it this way:

God is the one absolute, living Being—without any beginning or end.

hollowtrucker said:Can't you see how difficult this is to grasp?

Try again:

God is an absolute, living entity, existing without beginning or end.

One single being?
What even qualifies as a "being"?

The absolute possesses no "labels" or inherent shape of its own.😁

Karen Sanchez19 said:The Absolute doesn't have any "labels" or specific forms of its own😁

It’s always easy to play philosopher, isn't it?
But if we're being real, the Absolute possesses its own absolute forms and absolute markers.

Karen Sanchez19 said:One single being?
What exactly defines a being?

There is absolutely NO such thing as a "label" or any inherent form existing on its own.😁

I have to agree with you. If God is a sentient being—which I personally doubt—how did He pull "material" out of thin air to build the universe? To me, "God" is simply a creative energy. It isn't a conscious entity, but it is life itself. This energy manifested its own substance to spark existence; therefore, we are part of it. We live within it, and it experiences everything through us—our suffering and our joy alike. If God exists as a distinct individual, then He is the most selfish being imaginable. He created us just to say, "I exist, now deal with yourselves." My apologies if that offends anyone, but that’s how I see it.

hollowtrucker said:Philosophizing is the easy part.
The Absolute possesses absolute forms and absolute labels.

So what? What's your point?😁