Monaco GP 2015

That was precisely why he maintained such a level-headed composure; in the end, he was actually the one calling for the pit stop 🙂

stormybadger8 said:What does it actually mean to be the best instead of just winning...

And how was Hamilton better than Rosberg in Monaco? By the fact that unlike Rosberg, he uses his hands and feet, but clearly doesn't use his brain...

Because someone like that will always end up being seen by anyone who actually knows anything as a fraud and a loser. The marketing departments will get their money, sure, but the experts know the truth.

So, is Hamilton dim-witted? Yes. Is there anyone on the track right now who can touch him? No. Not even close.

Actually, it’s probably for the best that he lacks mental capacity; it gives everyone else a fighting chance. Imagine if he were actually smart too—would there even be a point in letting him compete against these little birds? He'd crush them all the way to Silverstone, every single time.

Nature eventually finds a way to maintain its own balance. That’s why Lujo is clueless. And that’s why a mediocrity like Rosberg actually has something to hope for.

And that's fine. That's just nature. It would be foolish if it were any different.

Honestly, Lujo didn't even give Button a run for his money—I really don't get why everyone is putting him on such a pedestal. Once he finds himself paired with someone in a car that can actually compete with a Mercedes, he’ll start playing those aggressive games just like he's done countless times before. It wouldn't take much; if Ferrari manages to match that pace, Vettel is going to eat him alive. The German is a force to be reckoned with, whereas Hamilton is just a bit of a rogue—talented, sure, but still a rogue at heart.

jadeseal7 said:Look, Lujo didn't even slap Jenson Button, so I have no idea why everyone is hyping this kid up so much. Once he gets paired with someone in a car that actually rivals a Mercedes, he’ll start acting out just like he’s done countless times before. It only takes Ferrari being equally fast for Vettel to eat him alive. A German is a German, and Hamilton is just a clown. A talented clown, sure, but still a clown.

That's not true. He was too distracted by everything else. When he actually keeps his head on straight, nobody can touch him. That's exactly what I was getting at.

steelmaker83 said:Actually, he isn't. When he's actually focused—which doesn't happen often enough—he's basically untouchable. That’s exactly what I was getting at.

He’s definitely got what it takes; it just takes about a thousand different variables to align perfectly before he can even dream of being on level ground with the rest of them—even when they're in those damn cars.

Another interesting thing to note—and it's pretty obvious if you look closely—is how people treated Sebastian Vettel back when he was winning in a car that wasn't nearly as competitive as Lewis Hamilton's. Back then, everyone was talking trash, claiming his only real achievement was beating Mark Webber. Now, look at how they're practically canonizing Hamilton, even though he's really just beating Nico Rosberg and himself most of the time.

Well, folks, that, my friends, is what we call MARKETING.

stormybadger8 said:What’s the point of being the best if you don't actually win...
And how was Hamilton supposedly better than Rosberg in Monaco? By the fact that unlike Rosberg, he used his hands and feet but completely forgot to use his brain...

He was "better" enough to leave him in the dust.
As for not winning, that was just a bad run of luck. Nothing more.
They screwed up—him and his crew.
But hey, what can you do? It happens. What, should we hang them for it!?

If this kind of thing happened every two or three races, then maybe we could talk about incompetence. But not like this.

After a few months, I find myself constantly thinking about that moment at the Lujo circuit when he foolishly slid right into the gravel while trying to hit the pit lane entry...

steelmaker83 said:How can you say that? Winning—unlike what graniteharbor502 claims—doesn't automatically make you the best. We saw that play out just the other night. It’s the same deal with some world champions... even some multi-time ones...

What I'm getting at is that ranking drivers by points is just pointless.

I mean, races are incredibly exact and measurable things.

First is the best, second is slightly less great, and so on.

It isn't figure skating or music where we need judges to score it.

Unless, of course, the competition itself is totally meaningless. Then who comes in first or second is decided by higher powers. But that's a whole different story.

This race really just proved how much marketing can lift an average driver straight to the heavens. He didn't dominate anyone, nor did he snag the fastest lap. Instead of pulling away, he actually lost time. It’s not that this track is cursed for him; it just exposes his driving weaknesses. Nico Rosberg has always been more successful here, and while he isn't exactly a mental powerhouse himself, he's feeling unburdened now. Meanwhile, Hamo is carrying all this weight because he's been artificially elevated by pure PR. As he knows deep down, that kind of hype eventually backfires. Carrying the weight of being the best isn't hard if you actually are the best—something many drivers managed to do in the past. Rosberg took the fastest lap, he won the race, and therefore, he's the best. Sure, he had the superior car, but setting the fastest lap on this circuit is no small feat.

If things get critical—and I honestly think they’re starting to—he’ll probably start getting a bit full of himself.

steelmaker83 said:How can you say that? A winner—contrary to what graniteharbor502 might insist—doesn't necessarily have to be the greatest of all time. We had a perfect opportunity to witness that very distinction just the other day, didn't we? It’s much the same with certain world champions... even those who have secured multiple titles...

Look, the stopwatch doesn't lie; everything else is just noise. Whatever you, or I, or anyone else might feel about who the best driver is, it carries no weight compared to the cold, hard truth provided by the timing sheets.

steelmaker83 said:Now, is Hamilton perhaps lacking a bit in the mental department? Yes, he is. But is there anyone on the track right now who can touch him? There isn't. Not even close.

And honestly, perhaps it is for the best that his wits aren't entirely sharp, as it grants a sliver of hope to the rest of the field. Can you imagine if he were actually brilliant as well as fast? Would it even make sense to let him compete among these little toy cars? He would simply steamroll them all the way to Silverstone, every single time.

Nature, in its infinite wisdom, always finds a way to maintain some semblance of balance. That is why Lujo is a bit scatterbrained, and why a mediocre talent like Nico Rosberg still has something to hope for.

Where was that peerless Hamilton just one race ago, back in Spain? And how is it that "a mediocrity like Rosberg" managed to beat him fairly and squarely?

And where was Hamilton during the News Report Malaysia, when a highly contested Sebastian Vettel beat him in an inferior car?

jadeseal7 said:Another interesting observation is that back when Vettel was winning in a significantly less competitive car than Hamilton's, people were spitting on him, claiming he only won because of Mark Webber; yet now, we see Hamilton being elevated to the heavens even though he is only beating Rosberg and himself.

Well, my friends, that, my dear friends, is what we call MARKETING.

Signed.

Wasn't it actually Rosberg who took fastest lap?

Fastest lap - Daniel Ricciardo, Red Bull, 1m 18.063s (lap 74)

A quick observation here. Whether people like Lewis Hamilton or not, the man is undeniably talented. He drives brilliantly. That’s an indisputable fact. If he has the best car on the grid, he does. But then again, so did Lauda, Senna, Prost, Mansell, Schumacher, Alonso, and Vettel.

Every single one of those world champions had the superior car at some point during their title runs. It’s the same story with Hamilton. In case anyone has forgotten, this is a sport where a massive cast of characters plays the lead roles—specifically the engineers who design and develop the machine. This is motor racing; as such, the car accounts for 50% of the success, and the driver accounts for the other 50%.

It isn't that I’m some massive Hamilton devotee—honestly, I’m not a huge fan of any driver—but I’ve followed F1 for years. I’ve been to plenty of races and I understand how these teams operate. I know it from firsthand experience.

All those guys working on these cars? They are grinding nearly 24/7. During a race weekend, sleep becomes a luxury. Mistakes happen; we are all human, after all.

Everyone is jumping on Hamilton now, but let's be real: while mistakes do occur, this particular one wasn't an accident. Hamilton signed a new contract, and I know there was talk about it during the briefings. At the meeting, it was made clear that even though they messed up, Hamilton needs to remember he is part of a team and the team has his back.

Unofficially? This wasn't just a blunder. It was a message to Hamilton that the team comes before everything else, especially him.

Now, we just wait to see where he stands and what happens next.

graniteharbor502 said:Look, the stats don't lie. Everything else is just noise. You can think someone is the best all you want, but unless the analytics back it up, it carries zero weight. The numbers tell the actual story.

And what does the timer say? How many seconds of lead did Hamilton actually build on Rosberg during the actual racing stints? That’s the metric the stopwatch tracks, isn't it? Not just driving behind a Safety Car, but actual racing.

ruggedhawk20 said:What I am trying to get at is that scoring drivers is an entirely pointless exercise.

After all, racing is such a precise and measurable phenomenon, isn't it?

The winner is simply the best, the runner-up is slightly less so, and so on and so forth.

It isn't figure skating or music where we need to rely on subjective judging.

Unless, of course, the competition itself lacks any inherent purpose. In that case, who finishes first or second would be decided by higher powers, but those are matters for another discussion entirely.

Fortunately, it isn't every day that Sir Frank celebrates his 70th birthday.🙂

@Hoot

It’s funny how people love to lecture everyone else about what defines a champion—claiming you can't tear one down just because they were dominant, while simultaneously putting someone else on a pedestal—yet they end up doing exactly that. In my view, the man enters these races knowing full well he's really only racing against Nico Rosberg. 🙏

I mean, look, if Nico Rosberg were Alain Prost, Ayrton Senna, or Michael Schumacher, we’d be having a completely different conversation—but he’s just Nico Rosberg. It feels similar to how Mark Webber was often dismissed as just being "poor old Webber," even though Sebastian Vettel actually had to contend with legends like Fernando Alonso and Lewis Hamilton. This guy? He hasn't got anyone like that.

For a long time, Vettel was basically the "guy everyone loved to hate," and yet nobody gave him his due credit for those titles. Personally, I find myself finally tipping my cap to him now in 2015, especially while watching this absolute farce of a last two seasons unfold.

It appears to me that a rather dangerous faction of haters is coalescing here, all aimed at attacking Lewis Hamilton’s character and his legacy.🍿🍿 I simply cannot fathom why people refuse to acknowledge the sheer, raw velocity this man possesses; frankly, looking at the current grid, I struggle to see anyone who could truly go toe-to-toe with him on pure pace.

When you look back at the Monaco GP 2015, Hamilton absolutely dismantled Nico Rosberg in that single session—it’s a rare thing to see someone utterly crush a teammate using the exact same machinery on the streets of Las Vegas. In my estimation, Nico Rosberg's victory was nothing more than a series of incredibly fortunate coincidences, nothing more and nothing less.

Now, I can certainly empathize with a certain level of skepticism toward Lewis, but this overwhelming wave of dismissal and belittlement has crossed a line from healthy debate into blatant trolling. It reaches a point where it becomes impossible to take some of these assertions seriously, as they defy any sense of reality.

steelmaker83 said:And what about what that statistician claims—exactly how many seconds of lead did Lewis Hamilton actually build over Nico Rosberg during the actual racing? Isn't that what a data analyst focuses on, isn't it? Not just driving behind the Safety Car, but the genuine race itself.

Lewis Hamilton truly earned his victory at the Monaco GP. It is just that the very same statistician pointed out, only two weeks ago, that Nico Rosberg was absolutely untouchable, rather than Lewis Hamilton. And where does that leave us now? Am I somehow peddling some sort of marketing scheme by suggesting that Lewis Hamilton is the superior driver?

Alexander Gonzalez79 said:but honestly, this level of constant condescension and downplaying things is starting to cross a line—it’s feeling more like trolling at this point, because it becomes impossible to take certain claims seriously when they're presented this way.

2010-2013 👍

stormybadger8 said:What's the point of being the best if you aren't actually winning...
And how exactly was Lewis Hamilton better than Nico Rosberg at the Monaco GP? By the fact that unlike Nico Rosberg, he used his hands and feet, but didn't bother using his brain much...

How he was better than Nico Rosberg, how interesting, haha🤣, I really have no need to comment on this one; you've simply outdone yourself.

Good grief, he left him twenty seconds behind in the exact same car🤦

Nico Rosberg didn't leave him twenty seconds behind when you factor in the full two years of racing and the overall advantage during that stretch.

graniteharbor502 said:Lewis Hamilton earned that win at the Monaco GP. The problem is, two weeks ago, that same damn stoplight suggested Nico Rosberg was untouchable, not Hamilton. Look where we landed. I'm not out here peddling some marketing scheme claiming Hamilton is the undisputed king.

We're sitting through the Monaco GP right now, and in about ten days, we'll be heading to the Canadian GP.