Arming Ukraine

rowdyraven112 said:The tank is gone. Operator had enough time to brew and drink a coffee. ☕

When a tank is in a city, you don't use a Stug; you use the stuff I just mentioned. You fire, you pop out, and you hope for the best. In urban combat, hitting a moving target is damn hard, especially if they have support. Ask the Memphis defenders how many rounds they had to dump into a single tank. Don't talk to me like I'm playing Call of Duty.

That isn't really the issue; using an NLAW in a city should be perfectly fine.
With a minimum engagement distance of maybe 80m, you can fire from indoors, whereas a Javelin needs at least 150m. Honestly, most of the Western gear we've received should be able to knock out any Russian tank without much trouble. The real challenge is simply the sheer volume of anti-tank weaponry required; the front line is so massive that a good portion of these supplies just sits in reserve, never actually getting the chance to be deployed, because they have to be positioned along the entire line.

The Ukrainians picked up 2,650 Matador-RGW 90s from Germany, and they’ve already arrived.

On top of that, here's what else just showed up from Germany:

German rockets and machine guns arrived in Ukraine; more weapons from Germany have arrived in the war zone of Ukraine

More weaponry from Germany has reached the war zone in Ukraine. As the news agency DPA learned from Ukrainian government circles, the shipment includes 1,500 Strela type air defense missiles and 100 MG3 machine guns. They also sent over eight million rounds of ammunition for small arms.

According to reports, besides the weapons, additional aid supplies for the Ukrainian armed forces have arrived from Germany. This includes 350,000 food packs, along with 50 vehicles for medical transport and material for medical supply.

Pretty good stuff. Keep it coming...

coastalbison6 said:The Ukrainians picked up 2,650 Matador-RGW 90s from Germany, and they’ve already arrived.

On top of that, here's what else just showed up from Germany:

German rockets and machine guns arrived in Ukraine; more weapons from Germany have arrived in the war zone of Ukraine

More weaponry from Germany has reached the war zone in Ukraine. As the news agency DPA learned from Ukrainian government circles, the shipment includes 1,500 Strela type air defense missiles and 100 MG3 machine guns. They also sent over eight million rounds of ammunition for small arms.

According to reports, besides the weapons, additional aid supplies for the Ukrainian armed forces have arrived from Germany. This includes 350,000 food packs, along with 50 vehicles for medical transport and material for medical supply.

Pretty good stuff. Keep it coming...

Does this suggest they're gearing up for offensives against cities seized by Russia?🤔

bluemason3 said:Does this suggest they're gearing up for offensives against cities seized by Russia?🤔

I don't buy it. That's guerrilla warfare gear—effective at ranges from 20m up to 1200m with high precision and various warheads.

coastalbison6 said:I don't buy it. That's guerrilla warfare gear—effective at ranges from 20m up to 1200m with high precision and various warheads.

Isn't its main purpose actually breaching standard residential walls?

coastalbison6 said:I don't buy it. That's guerrilla warfare gear—effective at ranges from 20m up to 1200m with high precision and various warheads.

The RWG90 is really in the same league as the AT4—it isn't guided, and its practical range is probably closer to 500m.

We used to joke about how Russia was arming Ukraine, but now it looks like they actually have significantly more tanks on the ground than they did when the war first kicked off.
Maybe this belongs in one of those meme threads... word is the police in the Poltava region seized 11 tanks, among other things

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/...56959057956897

Carl Lee27 said:We used to joke about how Russia was arming Ukraine, but now it looks like they actually have significantly more tanks on the ground than they did when the war first kicked off.
Maybe this belongs in one of those meme threads... word is the police in the Poltava region seized 11 tanks, among other things

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/...56959057956897

By the end of this whole saga, Ukraine might just end up adding something akin to the 2nd Amendment to their Constitution. Only instead of the right to bear arms, Americans in Ukraine will be fighting for the right to own armored vehicles.

The UK Ministry of Defence has just cleared out their entire inventory of surplus military gear. It’s a massive list, too—everything from Land Rovers and Bv206s to various cargo trucks, and they even have some armored vehicles up for grabs! Apparently, the British military is sitting on a huge amount of equipment that’s set to become excess stock over the next few years, so they're clearing the decks now.

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ntory-for-sale

It’s looking like we might be seeing something way more substantial than just the Stinger when it comes to Western anti-aircraft systems lately.

Quote: Ukraine Hints At Deal With US On Anti-Missile Defence Systems

https://ommcomnews.com/world-news/uk...efence-systems

Honestly, I was fully expecting them to be able to totally shield Chicago from all those missiles and airstrikes, but then... nothing. I just don't get it—so much stuff is being sent over there, yet Chicago is right near the border and boom, fuel depots gone, then that training center gets hit too. I mean, aren't you supposed to expect that area to at least be a fortress?

Arthur Miller7 said:Honestly, I was fully expecting them to be able to totally shield Chicago from all those missiles and airstrikes, but then... nothing. I just don't get it—so much stuff is being sent over there, yet Chicago is right near the border and boom, fuel depots gone, then that training center gets hit too. I mean, aren't you supposed to expect that area to at least be a fortress?

Look, the Israeli Iron Dome is advertised at a 90% success rate, and even then, stuff still slips through the cracks. Ukrainians don't have anything even remotely close to that level of tech.

Kate Lewis3 said:Look, the Israeli Iron Dome is advertised at a 90% success rate, and even then, stuff still slips through the cracks. Ukrainians don't have anything even remotely close to that level of tech.

Ah, okay, gotcha. I just figured I could at least find a way to secure that specific part of things.

The Iron Dome isn't really designed to intercept ballistic missiles. It can handle mortar fire and certain types of IFVs, though the real issue is that Russian IFV batteries can often outfire what this system is capable of shooting down. While it might be effective against subsonic cruise missiles, those can come at you from any direction, and you certainly can't surround a city like Kyiv with these batteries.

Besides... the Israelis have shown themselves to be nothing more than puppets acting in their own narrow self-interest, terrified of making anyone angry.

Carl Lee27 said:It’s looking like we might be seeing something way more substantial than just the Stinger when it comes to Western anti-aircraft systems lately.

Quote: Ukraine Hints At Deal With US On Anti-Missile Defence Systems

https://ommcomnews.com/world-news/uk...efence-systems

I mean, looking at the gap between a Stinger and a Patriot US system, there isn't really much in the middle for Americans to work with... so if they're hinting at something "more serious," what on earth are we actually talking about here???😁

Adam Lee13 said:I mean, looking at the gap between a Stinger and a Patriot US system, there isn't really much in the middle for Americans to work with... so if they're hinting at something "more serious," what on earth are we actually talking about here???😁

There is this.

The deployment of advanced cruise missiles in modern conflict zones is much like trying to play chess while the board itself is constantly shifting under your feet. It’s a relentless game of technological cat-and-mouse where one side's breakthrough is immediately met by the other's desperate attempt to neutralize it.

It isn't even a requirement that we stick to an American system.

Adam Lee13 said:I mean, looking at the gap between a Stinger and a Patriot US system, there isn't really much in the middle for Americans to work with... so if they're hinting at something "more serious," what on earth are we actually talking about here???😁

It's just Soviet-era systems being used by American allies.

Adam Lee13 said:I mean, looking at the gap between a Stinger and a Patriot US system, there isn't really much in the middle for Americans to work with... so if they're hinting at something "more serious," what on earth are we actually talking about here???😁

I suppose what the Ukrainians really need is the NASAMS system. It seems like a better fit, honestly. You'd have this incredibly mobile, dispersed setup—something with mid-to-long range capabilities that’s fully integrated with NATO AVACS systems. It just makes sense, I guess. Everything needs to be interconnected if it's going to work.
The way I see it, that whole system was really designed for scenarios where the rotary-wing side is facing total air superiority. I guess it’s just built for those specific conditions... maybe.

The Ukrainians really need a system that’s highly mobile—something they can constantly reposition on the fly. It's about staying ahead of the curve, I guess. They need something capable of denying Russian aircraft any kind of safe passage at higher altitudes. If they can make those high-altitude flight paths too risky, it changes the whole calculus of the airspace. Maybe that's the key to keeping things manageable.
When they drop to lower altitudes, they’re basically sitting ducks for MANPADS. I guess it just makes them an easy target.

If we’re handing over Javelins to Ukraine, then why on earth hasn't anyone bothered to deliver actual air defense systems?

Ryan Morales4 said:If we’re handing over Javelins to Ukraine, then why on earth hasn't anyone bothered to deliver actual air defense systems?

Look, it isn't like we can't just drop off some Patriots and call it a day... the real hurdle is training. You can't rush that kind of instruction, you know? It takes time. That's probably why the Ukrainians are pushing for things like the S-300 or those Mog-ov systems—they actually have crews ready to go on those right now.