Should we let go of our feelings?

David Vaughn75 said:Look, man, if you really think that’s the whole story, then fine—believe whatever helps you sleep at night. 🤷 Just don't come crying to me when reality hits, because honestly? Your take is like 1% of what people actually think. If anything, I should be the one looking at you like you've lost your mind. 😁

I don't know, I just believe it because it actually makes sense to me.
If life in this world just happens regardless of what we want, then it feels fundamentally unfair. Why does one guy end up with all the cash while another is broke? Why is one person loved by everyone and another totally isolated? Why is one person healthy while another is struggling with illness?

Karma is the only thing that adds up, but let's face it—we can't control the laws of karma even if we tried our hardest. Only God can mess with the laws of nature.

It's that classic moment where some guy is mocking you, but he's talking such absolute nonsense that you can't help but laugh in his face. 🙏 🙏

To be honest, your stats don't really hold much water. Actually, you’re probably the first person I've ever heard make that argument... which is likely my own fault, since I didn't exactly have the patience to sit through a lecture while someone tried to explain the nuances of it all. 🤷

Thomas Turner2 said:I honestly can't give you a definitive answer to that... though I think you already grasp that "union" shouldn't be taken quite so literally.

But what if we’re already one? Like, what if we should take that literally? Because that’s actually what science is starting to back up these days. People don't quite know how to wrap their heads around it yet, but the fact that we are unified—that we are one single entity—is no longer up for debate.

It’s all about finding that emotional balance. You have to clear out all that negative perception by actually understanding things and just... letting go.

Just be present right now. Be happy. Be satisfied. Because, honestly? You can do whatever the hell you want. Even with all those supposed "limitations" hanging over us, if things aren't working out, just try being more loving and more forgiving.

neonmarlin39 said:The way they put it sounds pretty dualistic, like they're splitting things into two worlds—the spiritual side and the material side. It makes me wonder though... where do thoughts fit into that split? They aren't purely spiritual, but they definitely aren't just physical matter either. 😁

Energy-wise, they are definitely non-material, but since they mostly build upon our empirical perceptions within the physical world, it seems most logical to me that they are—as a product of the mind, which is that third aspect of being—sort of a tool provided to us so that we, as spiritual beings, can actually navigate this material reality at all...

David Vaughn75 said:Look, man, if you really think that’s the whole story, then fine—believe whatever helps you sleep at night. 🤷 Just don't come crying to me when reality hits, because honestly? Your take is like 1% of what people actually think. If anything, I should be the one looking at you like you've lost your mind. 😁

I don't know, I just believe it because it actually makes sense to me.
If life in this world just happens regardless of what we want, then it feels fundamentally unfair. Why does one guy end up with all the cash while another is broke? Why is one person loved by everyone and another totally isolated? Why is one person healthy while another is struggling with illness?

Karma is the only thing that adds up, but let's face it—we can't control the laws of karma even if we tried our hardest. Only God can mess with the laws of nature.

It's that classic moment where some guy is mocking you, but he's talking such absolute nonsense that you can't help but laugh in his face. 🙏 🙏

To me, it’s perfectly logical that the first is tied to the second—meaning karma, or more accurately, the natural law of action and reaction, of cause and effect. Everything strives toward equilibrium, including the Universe itself, and to a person caught up in the concept of linear time, it looks like some kind of karma, a consequence or punishment (whether immediate or carried over from previous lives) finally catching up to them. But in reality, everything is happening simultaneously, right here in the present moment, and a person has the ability at any given instant to shift their mental framework, to change their reactions to material experiences, and thereby find freedom. It's just like a radio where various stations exist at different frequencies all at once, and it's up to the person to choose which one to tune into. It would be pretty foolish to suggest you're forced to listen only to whatever happens to be broadcasting right now; you can always just change the channel, can't you? 😉

Joseph Bailey41 said:To be honest, your stats don't really hold much water. Actually, you’re probably the first person I've ever heard make that argument... which is likely my own fault, since I didn't exactly have the patience to sit through a lecture while someone tried to explain the nuances of it all. 🤷

Every single religion out there operates on the idea that there's some kind of underlying purpose or reason why we're even here.
Sure, your physical body is just biology—conception, cells, all that jazz—but your spirit, or soul, or whatever you want to call it... that's supposed to come from some higher calling.

No religion on this planet claims that everything is just a massive, random accident.

rustymaker5 said:Energy-wise, they are definitely non-material, but since they mostly build upon our empirical perceptions within the physical world, it seems most logical to me that they are—as a product of the mind, which is that third aspect of being—sort of a tool provided to us so that we, as spiritual beings, can actually navigate this material reality at all...

To me, it’s perfectly logical that the first is tied to the second—meaning karma, or more accurately, the natural law of action and reaction, of cause and effect. Everything strives toward equilibrium, including the Universe itself, and to a person caught up in the concept of linear time, it looks like some kind of karma, a consequence or punishment (whether immediate or carried over from previous lives) finally catching up to them. But in reality, everything is happening simultaneously, right here in the present moment, and a person has the ability at any given instant to shift their mental framework, to change their reactions to material experiences, and thereby find freedom. It's just like a radio where various stations exist at different frequencies all at once, and it's up to the person to choose which one to tune into. It would be pretty foolish to suggest you're forced to listen only to whatever happens to be broadcasting right now; you can always just change the channel, can't you? 😉

My take? I believe that in the end, when you crunch all the numbers, everyone gets exactly what they truly wanted. You have total freedom to choose your path. Anything you desire right now, Bog can fulfill in the future—and He does.
The real headache is that people live in this massive illusion; they think they want one thing, but then they actually get it and realize they're totally disappointed.

Going back to my point about control... a guy spends all his time cooking up plans, mapping out exactly what he's going to do, starts grinding away at it, and then—boom—something totally unexpected happens and his whole scheme goes down the drain. That's just how it works with material plans. When it comes to the physical stuff, the ultimate controller is Bog, and things happen exactly how He intends them to.

But when you're talking about spiritual planning, the rules are completely different. 😉

David Vaughn75 said:Every single religion out there operates on the idea that there's some kind of underlying purpose or reason why we're even here.
Sure, your physical body is just biology—conception, cells, all that jazz—but your spirit, or soul, or whatever you want to call it... that's supposed to come from some higher calling.

No religion on this planet claims that everything is just a massive, random accident.

Most shameful religions don't even bother with a creation myth—they just assume existence is either eternal or completely unknowable.

rustymaker5 said:Energy-wise, they are definitely non-material, but since they mostly build upon our empirical perceptions within the physical world, it seems most logical to me that they are—as a product of the mind, which is that third aspect of being—sort of a tool provided to us so that we, as spiritual beings, can actually navigate this material reality at all...

To me, it’s perfectly logical that the first is tied to the second—meaning karma, or more accurately, the natural law of action and reaction, of cause and effect. Everything strives toward equilibrium, including the Universe itself, and to a person caught up in the concept of linear time, it looks like some kind of karma, a consequence or punishment (whether immediate or carried over from previous lives) finally catching up to them. But in reality, everything is happening simultaneously, right here in the present moment, and a person has the ability at any given instant to shift their mental framework, to change their reactions to material experiences, and thereby find freedom. It's just like a radio where various stations exist at different frequencies all at once, and it's up to the person to choose which one to tune into. It would be pretty foolish to suggest you're forced to listen only to whatever happens to be broadcasting right now; you can always just change the channel, can't you? 😉

What’s that supposed to mean? Energy is inherently material—it's a property of matter itself.

Maria Parker77 said:But what if we’re already one? Like, what if we should take that literally? Because that’s actually what science is starting to back up these days. People don't quite know how to wrap their heads around it yet, but the fact that we are unified—that we are one single entity—is no longer up for debate.

It’s all about finding that emotional balance. You have to clear out all that negative perception by actually understanding things and just... letting go.

Just be present right now. Be happy. Be satisfied. Because, honestly? You can do whatever the hell you want. Even with all those supposed "limitations" hanging over us, if things aren't working out, just try being more loving and more forgiving.

Exactly! 👍

I was watching this documentary the other day about astronauts who spent some time up there on NASA stations. Those people have seen things most of us will never experience, and they all seemed to agree that humanity’s entire perspective would shift completely if everyone could have an experience like that. Because they saw the USA and our whole world in a totally different light than how we usually see it, which helped them realize that our planet is basically one living organism where everything is tied to everything else. Unity, oneness... it's all right there, yet for some reason, people just stubbornly refuse to see it...😁

bluemason3 said:What’s that supposed to mean? Energy is inherently material—it's a property of matter itself.

But is it really just a property of matter?
I mean, what if matter is actually being forged by pure energy instead? Take the energy behind a thought, for instance... because honestly, nothing physical can ever truly come into existence unless there was first a spark of thought behind it...

David Vaughn75 said:My take? I believe that in the end, when you crunch all the numbers, everyone gets exactly what they truly wanted. You have total freedom to choose your path. Anything you desire right now, Bog can fulfill in the future—and He does.
The real headache is that people live in this massive illusion; they think they want one thing, but then they actually get it and realize they're totally disappointed.

Going back to my point about control... a guy spends all his time cooking up plans, mapping out exactly what he's going to do, starts grinding away at it, and then—boom—something totally unexpected happens and his whole scheme goes down the drain. That's just how it works with material plans. When it comes to the physical stuff, the ultimate controller is Bog, and things happen exactly how He intends them to.

But when you're talking about spiritual planning, the rules are completely different. 😉

And what, you think Bog is some kind of jukebox? Like, you just drop a coin in and eventually it plays whatever tune you wanted... unless the power goes out, I guess? 🤣

David Vaughn75 said:My take? I believe that in the end, when you crunch all the numbers, everyone gets exactly what they truly wanted. You have total freedom to choose your path. Anything you desire right now, Bog can fulfill in the future—and He does.
The real headache is that people live in this massive illusion; they think they want one thing, but then they actually get it and realize they're totally disappointed.

Going back to my point about control... a guy spends all his time cooking up plans, mapping out exactly what he's going to do, starts grinding away at it, and then—boom—something totally unexpected happens and his whole scheme goes down the drain. That's just how it works with material plans. When it comes to the physical stuff, the ultimate controller is Bog, and things happen exactly how He intends them to.

But when you're talking about spiritual planning, the rules are completely different. 😉

So what exactly is "spiritual planning" and what kind of rules are we even talking about here?

rustymaker5 said:But is it really just a property of matter?
I mean, what if matter is actually being forged by pure energy instead? Take the energy behind a thought, for instance... because honestly, nothing physical can ever truly come into existence unless there was first a spark of thought behind it...

And what if it’s actually being created by a pink gay unicorn wearing thongs on a rhinoceros?

The only kind of energy we actually know about—the physical phenomenon this term describes—has nothing to do with that.

So, what exactly do you mean by "pure energy"?

If that’s how you want to play it... 🍿

David Vaughn75 said:Every single religion out there operates on the idea that there's some kind of underlying purpose or reason why we're even here.
Sure, your physical body is just biology—conception, cells, all that jazz—but your spirit, or soul, or whatever you want to call it... that's supposed to come from some higher calling.

No religion on this planet claims that everything is just a massive, random accident.

People say all sorts of things. But this take you have about control is actually a pretty rare perspective. Besides, if we wanted to get into religious fantasies, there's another subforum for that.

David Vaughn75 said:Every single religion out there operates on the idea that there's some kind of underlying purpose or reason why we're even here.
Sure, your physical body is just biology—conception, cells, all that jazz—but your spirit, or soul, or whatever you want to call it... that's supposed to come from some higher calling.

No religion on this planet claims that everything is just a massive, random accident.

It’s wild to think that even just 400 years ago, people were still walking around convinced the entire world was just one big flat pancake.

James Miller2 said:Regarding morality, such conclusions can only be drawn on your own behalf, not on behalf of all mankind.
Without religious communities, man would struggle to find a sense of how to distinguish good from evil.

Most faiths preach peace, love, community, and forgiveness.
These are instructions for a happier life. Fantasy develops when a person refuses to engage with the world around them and stays trapped within the bubble of their own ego.

And I ask that people who have never practiced faith do not write about it. Passive observers should stay silent.

Sopdet, a believer has an authority above themselves. Someone watching and recording every thought and action.

An atheist has no one but themselves. They are "responsible" only to themselves.
That is a very dangerous territory for the development of the human spirit and soul.

Thanks for the detailed explanation.

Have you ever been a believer? Have you actually experienced what you are writing about?

Stories about seeing believers do non-religious things are nothing but old wives' tales.
You can find people like that on both "sides."

I am interested in your personal experience if you have ever been involved in this.
Then we might actually have a constructive conversation. You could present the facts that troubled you or things that didn't make sense to you.

The way you view faith is so lifeless, hollow, and purely factual.
It is all ideology, psychology, and philosophy.

If you lack the personal experience of feeling even a small amount of faith, you will never truly understand it; it will always remain within the realm of fantasy to you.

It is a different matter if you tried it and found it didn't work, or if too much remained unclear to you.
Otherwise, further discussion from my end is pointless. It would just be a waste of your energy and mine, and our precious time.

Most atheists don't see it that way.

Both atheists and theists (who, let's face it, are all just believers in something) deal with some kind of earthly authority above them.
The lucky thing for theists is they can push back against those earthly powers by leaning on an absolute authority.

Atheists mostly can't do that.

Thanks for the deep dive.

Were you ever a believer? Have you actually felt what you're writing about?

bluemason3 was a believer and still is, technically—he just swapped faiths... now he's a positivist, a physicalist, a naturalist, a scientist... some mashup of all that.

The tendency to defer to authority doesn't seem to be distributed evenly across the political spectrum; it’s definitely more pronounced on the right than on the left. That might be the only real differentiator. Other traits (like hostility toward outsiders or rigid convictions) tend to spike as you move toward either extreme, though they do lean a bit heavier toward the right.

I haven't come across a study specifically focused on religiousness yet (though I'm sure one exists), but given how religion functions and its general proximity to those authoritarian archetypes mentioned above, I'd bet there's a measurable higher inclination toward authority within religious circles—whether we're talking about earthly or divine power.

Speaking personally, if you really want to get into it (not that it matters much), back when I was more inclined toward faith, I was also more prone to respecting authority. Developing critical thinking skills and gaining life experience tends to erode both tendencies simultaneously. Anyway, glad you found a little pigeonhole for me. I don't have one myself. 🙄

Lisa Jackson7 said:Most atheists don't see it that way.

Both atheists and theists (who, let's face it, are all just believers in something) deal with some kind of earthly authority above them.
The lucky thing for theists is they can push back against those earthly powers by leaning on an absolute authority.

Atheists mostly can't do that.

Thanks for the deep dive.

Were you ever a believer? Have you actually felt what you're writing about?

bluemason3 was a believer and still is, technically—he just swapped faiths... now he's a positivist, a physicalist, a naturalist, a scientist... some mashup of all that.

Look, being forced to follow some political power is a totally different ballgame than daydreaming about gods. Just because the law holds you accountable doesn't mean you've suddenly become a religious person.

Lisa Jackson7 said:Most atheists don't see it that way.

Both atheists and theists (who, let's face it, are all just believers in something) deal with some kind of earthly authority above them.
The lucky thing for theists is they can push back against those earthly powers by leaning on an absolute authority.

Atheists mostly can't do that.

Thanks for the deep dive.

Were you ever a believer? Have you actually felt what you're writing about?

bluemason3 was a believer and still is, technically—he just swapped faiths... now he's a positivist, a physicalist, a naturalist, a scientist... some mashup of all that.

You hit the nail on the head right there. You've perfectly captured that massive, recurring issue with religion: people start devaluing actual human lives just to feed their own fantasies. That kind of warped logic is exactly how you end up with things like the Inquisition.

Lisa Jackson7 said:Most atheists don't see it that way.

Both atheists and theists (who, let's face it, are all just believers in something) deal with some kind of earthly authority above them.
The lucky thing for theists is they can push back against those earthly powers by leaning on an absolute authority.

Atheists mostly can't do that.

Thanks for the deep dive.

Were you ever a believer? Have you actually felt what you're writing about?

bluemason3 was a believer and still is, technically—he just swapped faiths... now he's a positivist, a physicalist, a naturalist, a scientist... some mashup of all that.

It’s all true: Bell-Sauron has basically become a STEM 🙂 fun😵-damentalist,

but if you ask me, his defining trait is how much he glosses over the messy details while obsessively relying on negative cherry-picking

hiddenpuma75 said:It’s all true: Bell-Sauron has basically become a STEM 🙂 fun😵-damentalist,

but if you ask me, his defining trait is how much he glosses over the messy details while obsessively relying on negative cherry-picking

Well, at least my main personality trait isn't using ad hominem attacks, strawman arguments, and every other logical fallacy in the book just because I lack a coherent point. 🕺 😁

David Vaughn75 said:Look, man, if you really think that’s the whole story, then fine—believe whatever helps you sleep at night. 🤷 Just don't come crying to me when reality hits, because honestly? Your take is like 1% of what people actually think. If anything, I should be the one looking at you like you've lost your mind. 😁

I don't know, I just believe it because it actually makes sense to me.
If life in this world just happens regardless of what we want, then it feels fundamentally unfair. Why does one guy end up with all the cash while another is broke? Why is one person loved by everyone and another totally isolated? Why is one person healthy while another is struggling with illness?

Karma is the only thing that adds up, but let's face it—we can't control the laws of karma even if we tried our hardest. Only God can mess with the laws of nature.

It's that classic moment where some guy is mocking you, but he's talking such absolute nonsense that you can't help but laugh in his face. 🙏 🙏

Like what, for example?