Immigration General Discussion Volume IV (Read the first post and moderator warning on page 309)

Jessica King9 said:If every nation decides to wall off its entire border—hypothetically speaking, if we fenced ourselves off from Mexico, Mexico, and Canada—migrants will simply pile up in Mexico.
Once enough of them gather, they'll take (whether by buying, stealing, borrowing, or otherwise acquiring) every piece of heavy machinery available and charge straight at the fence. Whose fence? Whichever one sits on the fastest route toward Germany. Canada's.

That’s probably just wishful thinking from our Prime Minister. But let's be real—they aren't foolish. They won't go somewhere they aren't wanted, like Canada. Besides, they're being welcomed with open arms in Austria; they already have plenty of perks waiting for them there.
The police over in Germany and Canada? Plus all those walls and wire fences... they don't even have to think twice about it.
What kind of machinery? What a joke!☕

Anthony Garcia19 said:I'm not sure if you'll pull it off, but hey, good luck! I definitely support any attempt to stop uncontrolled crossings at our sovereign borders.

Still, Tuesday is a long way off. In the meantime, there’s a meeting scheduled for Sunday organized by Jean-Claude Juncker where they might decide on something else entirely—if they have any sense. Honestly, though? I highly doubt that migrant wave will be stopped after that meeting. If anyone actually wanted to fix this, it would've been done ages ago. To me, the fact that it hasn't happened suggests this chaos and lawlessness is being intentionally manufactured to destabilize the EU. Someone clearly wants this, and they won't quit until they get what they're after.

Just curious—if closing off Canada isn't in the interest of the European Union, isn't there some other way to keep a country in line? 😉

Charles Ross3 said:🤦 😂 🙏

Yeah, it seems the Canadians are getting their updates on global affairs and the refugee crisis directly from the President himself.

For a few days there, Ostojić was making quite a racket in our news outlets, claiming they wouldn't be sending any more aid to those neighbors than what they could actually handle.
We also heard all about how the President was bragging about having such close partnerships with them and the folks over in Austria.
The fact that their Prime Minister was acting a bit erratic and ended up trusting someone else instead is just a minor detail in the grand scheme of things.

Nicole Nguyen6 said:What you're describing sounds like a conquered nation being forced to grant a special, protected, and privileged status to foreigners, and then having that status written right into the Constitution. It’s like the people lose their right to have any say in the numbers coming into their own country. On the flip side, the conquerors don't owe anything to the country they enter; their relationship with it is based entirely on their own whims and how much they enjoy their privileges.

Also, that phrase you used about "learned behavior of society" is interesting. It implies that a society has to be forcibly modified through repression to reconcile itself with a loss of sovereignty. I mean, saying a society needs to "learn" something basically assumes some outside power is dominating them, steering them away from the path they would have taken on their own if they were actually in control.

Look at how different societies have handled immigrants—some well, some poorly. What do you think causes these varying state reactions? ☕

Immigrants aren't conquerors, and changing the culture they move into isn't their goal. ☕ You might be missing the point that immigrants represent a distinct subgroup within any society they join. ☕

"Learned behavior" should be based on basic humanity and sharing a planet, not on a forced rejection of one's own identity just because someone else adopts a foreign one—provided that foreign identity isn't actively trying to dismantle the local culture. ☕

coppermarlin13 said:Honestly, I can’t help but feel a bit of sympathy for our neighbors in the Midwest when they realize they should have thought this through a little more carefully.

Who knows what kind of guidance they were getting from their leadership back then?

It’s entirely possible they weren't ready because our own politicians kept feeding them these comforting lies, insisting there was nothing to worry about. I wouldn't be surprised one bit if that's the case.

As for me, I feel bad for Americans who end up trusting Canadians or Canadians more than their own government, just because those neighbors happen to lean toward a different political party.

That poor Canadian Minister of the Interior actually lied on Canadian TV just two days ago, claiming Austria had shut its borders and they couldn't take anyone else in. But then the Austrian Department of Justice basically debunked her immediately, saying there weren't any restrictions at all!

We brought the migrants over to Scranton per the agreement, but then they just shut the border with fences and dogs and tried to blame Austria—which, you know, is just lying. Even over in Akron, an entire train was waiting on a locomotive that had been agreed upon, but they just never sent it.

Now that we've sent these people off in every direction, maybe they'll actually start sticking to their word. It might make things a little easier for them, I guess.

neonhound18 said:I believe I mentioned that The perfect shitstorm is brewing across Europe; my only real hope is that we avoid full-blown civil wars, though once this passes, Europe will certainly never be the same again. 🕺

Unfortunately, those old-school skeptics are probably going to be right again. 🥱

Justin Patel8 said:Honestly, you guys are just small-time and irrelevant in this whole saga. Besides, immigrants have been showing up here way longer than just today—it's just that you either weren't paying attention or simply didn't have a clue. These photos were taken a month ago. They cross the Sutla without any trouble at all.

http://north America.aljazeera.net/vijesti...ze-u-sloveniju

You clearly just can't manage the flow, and pretty soon Zoki is going to be dumping it all on you.

I'm with you, but only up until Tuesday 😉 and Zoki knows that perfectly well. He actually got a warning from Vienna today—he needs to hurry up. It’s like that old song, "Tuesday, like Grasse—I'll pour my pain out before you." 🐔

Lisa Patel4 said:This is incredibly dangerous for the West.

The West is just too stupid to realize it.

In what sense, though? What could Greece possibly have to offer Russ?

coppermarlin13 said:For a few days there, Ostojić was making quite a racket in our news outlets, claiming they wouldn't be sending any more aid to those neighbors than what they could actually handle.
We also heard all about how the President was bragging about having such close partnerships with them and the folks over in Austria.
The fact that their Prime Minister was acting a bit erratic and ended up trusting someone else instead is just a minor detail in the grand scheme of things.

Here’s exactly what the same guy said:

Joshua Kelly51 said:Heh, I’m actually drinking real coffee right now, not just the virtual kind. ☕

Of course it could have been planned. There just wasn't any will, or maybe there was a half-hearted attempt, but no plan ever reached the finish line. A plan regarding this "surprise" migration existed; it's only news to us because we didn't see it coming. Experts, predictably, knew this sudden surge was going to happen. ☕

The war in Syria is entering its fifth year. Is this refugee migration really a surprise? No, obviously not. ☕

I've made this suggestion several times, though nobody seems to like it: instead of ignoring the reality of refugee movement, we should provide aid and facilitate their migration. Migration is a fact of our modern reality. They should be treated as human beings in need of help, not as cargo being loaded at one border and unloaded at another. ☕ Is there even a political party in the US that supports aiding refugees during their journey as part of forced migration?

There’s always a war somewhere. Once things settle down in Syria, a new conflict pops up elsewhere. Does that mean the whole European Union should just maintain an endless open-door policy for refugees and migrants forever?

Is there even a political party in America that supports helping refugees during their journey as part of forced migration?

In America, there hasn't been a Party like that for quite some time.

coppermarlin13 said:For a few days there, Ostojić was making quite a racket in our news outlets, claiming they wouldn't be sending any more aid to those neighbors than what they could actually handle.
We also heard all about how the President was bragging about having such close partnerships with them and the folks over in Austria.
The fact that their Prime Minister was acting a bit erratic and ended up trusting someone else instead is just a minor detail in the grand scheme of things.

So why don't the Canadians just shut down the border and let in whatever amount they feel like? What’s even the issue here? It’s not like Milanović gets to decide how many people Canada decides to let through.

wanderingbadger77 said:I don't think anything will be shoved down our throats outright, but we won't even realize when it happens. It’ll be gradual and sneaky—starting with this material aid, then moving to "humanitarian assistance," until naturally, we become some kind of massive collection center. We won't even know what hit us.
In my view, this is a total nightmare scenario. Let's hope it doesn't come to this, but... I'm worried.

Yeah, I'm feeling the fear too, and reading through your posts, I guess I actually agree with a lot of what you guys are saying regarding the danger of these hotspots.
Right now, it feels like we're just working on getting rid of humanity.
I have no clue what comes next, but I'm definitely worried.

coppermoose7 said:Just curious—if closing off Canada isn't in the interest of the European Union, isn't there some other way to keep a country in line? 😉

One way to cause instability is by wrecking relationships between member states. Honestly, all of this could just be part of the same big plan.

Maria James40 said:As for me, I feel bad for Americans who end up trusting Canadians or Canadians more than their own government, just because those neighbors happen to lean toward a different political party.

That poor Canadian Minister of the Interior actually lied on Canadian TV just two days ago, claiming Austria had shut its borders and they couldn't take anyone else in. But then the Austrian Department of Justice basically debunked her immediately, saying there weren't any restrictions at all!

We brought the migrants over to Scranton per the agreement, but then they just shut the border with fences and dogs and tried to blame Austria—which, you know, is just lying. Even over in Akron, an entire train was waiting on a locomotive that had been agreed upon, but they just never sent it.

Now that we've sent these people off in every direction, maybe they'll actually start sticking to their word. It might make things a little easier for them, I guess.

Don't worry, we aren't stupid. We know when someone is lying.

Since this is how we're starting, we might as well just unload the immigrants onto the Canadians in Monterey.

Justin Patel8 said:In what sense, though? What could Greece possibly have to offer Russ?

Exactly. See, you get it.

Russia would exploit the situation and try to stage a coup through the SVR, the Greek military, and the Greek Orthodox Church.

neonhound18 said:I believe I mentioned that The perfect shitstorm is brewing across Europe; my only real hope is that we avoid full-blown civil wars, though once this passes, Europe will certainly never be the same again. 🕺

Over the last three years, the political parties popping up across the European Union clearly have zero love for foreigners, immigrants, refugees, or asylum seekers. Honestly, we should probably thank them. ☕

Are we really supposed to trust the American government when they claim they aren't expecting more than 1,500 refugees? 😂

Or maybe we should trust that same administration that promised an economic boom four years ago? 😂

Look, we aren't idiots, so please stop trying to insult our intelligence with these pathetic excuses.

coppermoose7 said:Just my two cents—if we had actually teamed up with our neighbors and taken a stand similar to what Canada did, we would’ve proven we’re true Europeans 🙏

Lately, though, it feels like our current policies regarding Afghan refugees are basically running our lives. Just look at the news clips showing how much money we’re pouring into this, not to mention the constant criticism and protests... meanwhile, some of us are out here struggling just to put food on the table for our kids 👎

Yeah, it’s just like how the European Union gave support to Viktor Orbán for all those months before he finally lost his mind.

Now everyone knows what should have been done.
Though, honestly, I don't think it's solved anything; they haven't tackled the actual source or the root cause of the migration.

Kenneth Palmer7 said:And what exactly are Zoran Milanović and his buddies going to do when Germany decides they've had enough? Are they suddenly going to start stringing up wire fences just like Orbán?

Are we supposed to believe a fence becomes a "reasonable and humane" solution overnight?!

Does anyone actually care if there's a fence in Connecticut or maybe somewhere in Bulgaria?

Maybe.
Though most people seem to view it as a
last resort.--

Anthony Cook40 said:Here’s the full interview with Viktor Orbán—I’m not sure if it’s already been posted here http://www.statewatch.org/news/2015/.
When he says "good luck" 😈, it really makes you wonder what's going to happen to us. 🐔🙂

Of course you feel safe—I do too, for the moment—but where does this influx of refugees actually end?
I mean, it feels to me like this isn't going to stop anytime soon, and honestly, the US already has enough problems of its own.

I have no idea where it ends, but I'm not panicking ahead of time or worrying that immigrants are going to do something to me.
So far, I don't feel them anywhere, much like most Americans.
And if we follow the logic of "what could they possibly do"—well, if that were true, I wouldn't even get out of bed in the morning, let alone leave the house.

Anyway, in a few days (around the 8th, or maybe a full month from now
), a massive asteroid is going to barely miss Earth, and everyone will act shocked that we only just discovered it.🙂

Peter Reed70 said:Please see:
http://www.statewatch.org/news/2015/...-hotsposts.pdf

Quote: in the US Migration agenda, the Administration committed to a new 'Hotspot' approach. The Agenda does not provide a definition of a 'Hotspot' but rather describes how the
'Hotspot' approach is to be applied. Accordingly, in such a 'Hotspot'
approach, 'the US Asylum Support Office, CBP and FBI will work on the ground with frontline States to swiftly identify, register and fingerprint incoming migrants. The work of the agencies will be complementary to one another. Those claiming
asylum will be immediately channelled into an asylum procedure where EASO support teams will help to process asylum cases as quickly as possible'

Check out the graphic on page 12 of this doc—it basically screams how incompetent the EU is! Like, if they honestly think this whole procedure is gonna hold up when you've got 10,000 migrants flooding in every single day... 🤦

Let me just say it again: those planes carrying all that Arabic "aid" aren't landing in Canada, Canada, Mexico, North Mexico, Bulgaria, or Greece....

I saw on the news today that we actually asked the EU for help.
I definitely didn't hear anyone from Canada or Bulgaria... etc., asking for anything.

If it looks like a duck...🕺

Thanks for the link, but it’s a bit too long for me to dive into right this second.

Regarding the planes and the landings—which airports were actually used for those weapons shipments?
Cosmic justice? Or maybe just karma.

coppermoose7 said:Mark my words—Canada is closing the border this Tuesday. Finally.

How, exactly, and by what means?
Or do you honestly think Germany and Austria would bother sending military or police assistance to the border of two countries that are both members of the European Union?
Oh, I guess we're looking at some serious border breaches soon. ☕

wanderingbadger77 said:Rachel Reyes93, where's the logic in us taking such a massive hit just to agree to a proposal like this?
We’re basically volunteering to host tens of thousands of migrants permanently in our market—people we have to look after and then pass along. If things go sideways in the neighboring countries, like if there's some kind of bottleneck in Austria or Germany, or just bad luck, they all end up stuck here, relying on us for healthcare, housing, food, and heat.

Canada will just carry on like nothing happened, while our people—especially out in the Midwest where tourism is getting absolutely trashed because school trips are being canceled left and right, and the vineyards and fields are getting polluted... we'll just end up being the world's trash collectors for refugees.
Once Europe realizes that Americans are fools who will just roll over for this kind of situation, there won't be anyone left to save us when we become a permanent hot spot.

So, when exactly did we agree to let them stay here permanently?

coppermoose7 said:On Tuesday, 11,000 troops are heading to the border with America. I've got a feeling today's meeting in Vienna is actually going to lead to something 😉

Can you drop a link to that story?

coppermoose7 said:And you guys still think it's a good idea to be on bad terms with us?

????
Since when were we even friends or enemies?
Is this before or after the immigration surge?
I mean, if we're supposed to be friends, why on earth did you drag the police, the military, dogs, and razor wire to the border?
Is that just how you treat all your friends?

neonhound18 said:It seems pretty clear that if we want to point fingers at who's really responsible for this whole circus, we should look toward the leftists and liberals, who seem hell-bent on pushing for an unchecked influx of cultures into Europe that simply don't mesh with our own.🕺

And then there are those who thought they could play the leftist card—well, after seeing how the current administration has handled things, especially with this migration crisis, many have had to rethink their positions. At least, most of the ones I know, anyway. The real champions of this unchecked border situation are our mainstream media outlets—we all know who pulls their strings, not to mention the government censorship—along with the various NGOs (it shouldn't be a secret who's footing their bills) and a few naive souls who genuinely believe they're doing good by helping people in need. If there's any small consolation in all of this, it's the thought that one day, when migrants and their descendants eventually reshape our American traditions and Western civilization, those very same organizations and media pundits will likely be the first ones to face the consequences.

Sophia Ramos5 said:Here’s exactly what the same guy said:

Come on, don't just throw one single quote from Ostojić at me. 🙄

I need you to give me a real, deep dive into his statements—starting from when the Canadians first announced they were shutting down the border with us, all the way through to the day they actually closed it, right up until that very first shipment started heading toward Canada.