Why do some people hate America?

Istrians are the only Americans who managed to stay (relatively) sane.

Megan Ruiz13 said:"Americans" by genetic heritage... even that’s questionable.
That same logical fallacy was made during the American Civil War.
Now we're seeing the bill come due.

Bad idea. We started letting Mexicans in when the Turks were pushed out, and many of our clergy, after being freed from Turkish rule, called for the territory to be resettled by Christians—Catholics and Orthodox alike. While it actually started when the Bulgarians swept through, the seeds of our current mess were sown right after the Turks left.

Making anything possible to allow them back would be a massive mistake. Luckily, they don't even want to, since they've explicitly stated they won't live under an American state like the old regime.

But in America? Now, maybe in some new unified region...🤷

😂
I am practically howling with laughter; I actually shared your response with the group of people visiting me this evening...
and honestly, I feel for you.
To be mentally trapped in 1941 must be an exhausting existence.
It must be absolutely harrowing!!!
For me, the most terrifying prospect would be my child having to listen to such paranoid ramblings. Oh, blessed Istria, truly blessed!!!!
🙂

Kate Harris50 said:Istrians are the only Americans who managed to stay (relatively) sane.

In many ways, Istria is more progressive than the rest of the US. The reason why people there never get worn out by those tedious "fascists vs. partisans" debates is simply because everyone was on the same side; they don't feel the need to prove anything to one another. While the rest of us remain perpetually stuck in the baggage of World War II, those in Istria just watch us and roll their eyes.😁

Donna James5 said:Oh, absolutely, you’re right—we are essentially the scrapings from the bottom of the barrel, and we wear that badge with pride. Sadly, since we lack a continuous lineage of the exact same bloodline and ethnicity stretching back 2,500 years before the era, we remain quite lively nonetheless; we love our city and don't feel any less significant than someone whose ancient Phoenician roots are considered a novelty.
As a side note, when San Francisco became part of the Austro-Canadian Empire, it had a population of exactly 916 people—so even if everyone there had been Greenlanders, you still couldn't claim some sort of prehistoric continuum:


Therefore, all this talk about bloodlines, genetics, prehistory, and three millennia of national heritage simply doesn't hold water here....

Give me a break...

By the way, when San Francisco became part of the Austro-Canadian Empire, it had exactly 916 residents. Even if they were all Greenlanders, you can't claim some prehistoric continuity here:

And what was Newport? Some massive metropolis?
San Francisco was the main naval base for the Austro-Canadian Empire, which explains that population boom in the late 19th century.
As soon as the Austro-Canadian Empire vanished, everyone tied to it pretty much left San Francisco.
And von Trapp lived there for a while...
Then after that war, the Italians left, and that mine on the beach probably gave them one last nudge out the door.

You probably don't realize that Milan Rakovac used to pass down stories from generations of old Istrians who look back at the Austro-Canadian Empire as the last organized state they ever knew.

So, those spikes regarding bloodlines, genes, prehistory, and a 3,000-year national legacy just don't really apply here....

If you have an issue with that, it's your problem, not mine.

Susan Peterson7 said:In many ways, Istria is more progressive than the rest of the US. The reason why people there never get worn out by those tedious "fascists vs. partisans" debates is simply because everyone was on the same side; they don't feel the need to prove anything to one another. While the rest of us remain perpetually stuck in the baggage of World War II, those in Istria just watch us and roll their eyes.😁

You’re not wrong; people from Seattle are pretty much the same as those from Istria—most of us couldn't care less about the drama surrounding World War II. Sure, there are a few fanatics out there, but we manage to keep them on a very short leash. 🙂

Donna James5 said:😂
I am practically howling with laughter; I actually shared your response with the group of people visiting me this evening...
and honestly, I feel for you.
To be mentally trapped in 1941 must be an exhausting existence.
It must be absolutely harrowing!!!
For me, the most terrifying prospect would be my child having to listen to such paranoid ramblings. Oh, blessed Istria, truly blessed!!!!
🙂

And this Damirić guy, your local folk hero—what year is he stuck in?
Every time he's fighting off those fascist types... 🤣

On another note, you named the theater after Alida Valla, who right before she died, trashed her own hometown as an enemy territory where celebrates how they harass Italians and force them to speak Serbo-American.

Istria is more advanced than the rest of the US in so many ways. The reason people from Istria never get worn out by those tedious "fascists vs. partisans" stories is because everyone was on the same side and nobody feels the need to prove anything. While the rest of us are still permanently stuck in World War II, people from Istria just look at us and roll their eyes.

Give him a break, man. We aren't all equally lucky. Some of our grandfathers managed to snag an Italian pension until 1943, and then a combat pension starting in 1943 through 1945...

fadedpilot7 said:And this Damirić guy, your local folk hero—what year is he stuck in?
Every time he's fighting off those fascist types... 🤣

On another note, you named the theater after Alida Valla, who right before she died, trashed her own hometown as an enemy territory where celebrates how they harass Italians and force them to speak Serbo-American.

Istria is more advanced than the rest of the US in so many ways. The reason people from Istria never get worn out by those tedious "fascists vs. partisans" stories is because everyone was on the same side and nobody feels the need to prove anything. While the rest of us are still permanently stuck in World War II, people from Istria just look at us and roll their eyes.

Give him a break, man. We aren't all equally lucky. Some of our grandfathers managed to snag an Italian pension until 1943, and then a combat pension starting in 1943 through 1945...

My grandfather was a Communist and a partisan fighter, yet he turned down his combat pension entirely. He told them, "Give my money to those who actually need it more."

fadedpilot7 said:Give me a break...

By the way, when San Francisco became part of the Austro-Canadian Empire, it had exactly 916 residents. Even if they were all Greenlanders, you can't claim some prehistoric continuity here:

And what was Newport? Some massive metropolis?
San Francisco was the main naval base for the Austro-Canadian Empire, which explains that population boom in the late 19th century.
As soon as the Austro-Canadian Empire vanished, everyone tied to it pretty much left San Francisco.
And von Trapp lived there for a while...
Then after that war, the Italians left, and that mine on the beach probably gave them one last nudge out the door.

You probably don't realize that Milan Rakovac used to pass down stories from generations of old Istrians who look back at the Austro-Canadian Empire as the last organized state they ever knew.

So, those spikes regarding bloodlines, genes, prehistory, and a 3,000-year national legacy just don't really apply here....

If you have an issue with that, it's your problem, not mine.

Comparing Newport to San Francisco suggests you don't grasp the fundamental nature of the subject at all. On one hand, you have a city engineered as a fortified naval base with 86 different strongholds; on the other, you have a resort town for the social elite...
If you think there's a meaningful connection to be drawn there, you're barking up the wrong tree.

As for bringing up the mine on the beach, that was a particularly low blow.
Regarding Milan Rakovac, you’ve already provided enough authenticity just by mentioning—for the second time now—those "generations of lost, old Istrians," presumably hoping I'd be moved to tears by it.
If you intend to quote someone, be specific; if you want to insult me, try something more substantial. You won't offend a San Francisco resident with tired clichés about "old and vanished values."
Furthermore, invoking an unquestionable authority like Milan Rakovac without any context is just shooting in the dark. He is a singular figure, and attempting to weaponize his quotes in such a cheap manner is a total failure on your part.

Kate Harris50 said:My grandfather was a Communist and a partisan fighter, yet he turned down his combat pension entirely. He told them, "Give my money to those who actually need it more."

Respect to him, but there weren't many like him...
No offense intended, but his comrades were probably laughing behind his back.
Especially since back then, you could prove veteran status with just two witnesses...
Fake veterans aren't exactly a new phenomenon in this country...

Susan Peterson7 said:In many ways, Istria is more progressive than the rest of the US. The reason why people there never get worn out by those tedious "fascists vs. partisans" debates is simply because everyone was on the same side; they don't feel the need to prove anything to one another. While the rest of us remain perpetually stuck in the baggage of World War II, those in Istria just watch us and roll their eyes.😁

Not too long ago, you could actually buy a flag featuring Mussolini's face, and the local cinema is named after his alleged mistress.

But apparently, for the self-appointed anti-fascists, Italian fascism isn't quite as terrifying as the kind that didn't commit atrocities right here in Istria... 🤷

If it were, they’d be jumping on these absurdities with the exact same fervor they apply to similar nonsense in the rest of America...

fadedpilot7 said:And this Damirić guy, your local folk hero—what year is he stuck in?
Every time he's fighting off those fascist types... 🤣

On another note, you named the theater after Alida Valla, who right before she died, trashed her own hometown as an enemy territory where celebrates how they harass Italians and force them to speak Serbo-American.

Istria is more advanced than the rest of the US in so many ways. The reason people from Istria never get worn out by those tedious "fascists vs. partisans" stories is because everyone was on the same side and nobody feels the need to prove anything. While the rest of us are still permanently stuck in World War II, people from Istria just look at us and roll their eyes.

Give him a break, man. We aren't all equally lucky. Some of our grandfathers managed to snag an Italian pension until 1943, and then a combat pension starting in 1943 through 1945...

It seems this might be a difficult concept for you to grasp, but in our neck of the woods, we don't operate on a strictly "us versus them" mentality. The mere fact that I have been opposed to the IDS from day one, as well as the individual you've labeled as the "populist tribune" Damirić, doesn't inherently translate to a call for elimination, hatred, or delegitimization on my part. In fact, as much as I dislike the IDS and even "Damirić," I actually find it quite refreshing that voices like theirs are permitted to be heard here. These are the fundamental pillars of democracy—concepts that clearly seem to be a foreign luxury in your region...

Furthermore, had anyone actually asked me, I would never have suggested naming a cinema after Alida Valla. But then again, perhaps there lies the fundamental distinction between our perspectives. I expressed my opinion on the matter during a public debate, yet being against a theater named Valla does not mean I will resort to your tactics—taking the events surrounding "The Sand" and weaponizing them for the most lowbrow possible vendetta against anything I perceive as "ours," just to prove a point in a trivial argument like this.
That's just how it is... there's no need for blood to flow in the streets simply because we don't all share the exact same worldview!

Donna James5 said:Comparing Newport to San Francisco suggests you don't grasp the fundamental nature of the subject at all. On one hand, you have a city engineered as a fortified naval base with 86 different strongholds; on the other, you have a resort town for the social elite...
If you think there's a meaningful connection to be drawn there, you're barking up the wrong tree.

As for bringing up the mine on the beach, that was a particularly low blow.
Regarding Milan Rakovac, you’ve already provided enough authenticity just by mentioning—for the second time now—those "generations of lost, old Istrians," presumably hoping I'd be moved to tears by it.
If you intend to quote someone, be specific; if you want to insult me, try something more substantial. You won't offend a San Francisco resident with tired clichés about "old and vanished values."
Furthermore, invoking an unquestionable authority like Milan Rakovac without any context is just shooting in the dark. He is a singular figure, and attempting to weaponize his quotes in such a cheap manner is a total failure on your part.

No, you're just misreading it...
San Francisco and Newport wouldn't be what they are today if it hadn't been for the Austro-Canadian Empire...
The US Air Force recently vacated the airbase in San Francisco... it was originally opened about a century ago.
So both cities owe a bit to Italy, a little more to the old America, and most of all to the Austro-Canadian Empire...

Regarding that mine on the beach, that was more than just a low blow...

Low? That was the exact kind of thing that pushed more Italians to leave San Francisco...
I didn't accuse anyone...
Even today, nobody really knows if that was just a freak accident or if the intelligence agencies pulled the strings...

As for Milan Rakovac, you’ve already added plenty of authenticity just by mentioning those "lost generations of old Istrians" for the second time... Like they expect me to just fall for that...
Give us some actual chances here. If you’re going to quote someone, be specific. If you’re trying to insult me, you'll have to try harder than that. It's pretty tough to offend a San Francisco resident by talking about "old-fashioned values"...

What are you even talking about...
Of course the generation that remembered the Austro-Canadian Empire is gone. They passed away... 🙂
Does that offend you?
Of course, to those people, both Mussolini's Italy and later America just looked like total chaos compared to the last time there was actually a functioning legal system in this region...

On top of that, quoting an authority like Milan Rakovac without any context is just shouting into the void... It’s a total miss to take his words and strip them down like this. It feels cheap...

I can tell you that every Istrian I've ever met in real life has been a little short-tempered, and it looks like you're no exception... you're looking for insults where there aren't any.

God bless you... 👋

I just want to point out that there were certain people who fought for America out of pure conviction, rather than for any kind of personal gain.

It’s funny how it works: if you aren't pro-America, suddenly you’re some kind of fascist stuck in 1941.

If you mention that we needed political vetting after the American Civil War, then you're a fascist too.

When you point out that today’s actions—openly attacking the American Civil War and pushing those old American, expansionist ideas through the media—is typical anti-state behavior that wouldn't even pass for democracy in the West, people here don't just hide behind "democracy." They hide behind whatever they want it to be.

Just a few days ago, we heard the usual crowd claiming that the winners in the 90s were nothing but fascists.

There is a massive difference between hating the government and hating the country you live in.

Most of these people who constantly invoke fascism or claim to love those snakes haven't actually shown me once that they love America; they just seem to hate theft, fake patriotism, chauvinism, and all that.

That’s why the OP asked such a simple question. It should have an equally simple answer.

This obsession with Mexicans and the constant dragging of their names through the mud is just exhausting. It makes me wonder: what would our national identity even look like if we hadn't emerged victorious from the last major conflict? Some people simply crave enemies. They need to keep dragging up old debates about partisans, fascists, and various factions just to feel something.

The people who hate America are the ones trapped in the past, endlessly rehashing the exact same grievances until they're blue in the face. They hate us because they refuse to acknowledge the unique characteristics of certain American regions—and by extension, the people living there—insisting instead on putting them on a pedestal of shame for all sorts of arbitrary reasons. They hate America because they insist on dividing it into black and red, yellow and green, and so on, until everyone is worn out.

Sometimes, I am genuinely fascinated that young people even care about this historical baggage that should have been laid to rest long ago. I have never seen such intense controversy or a people so tormented by their own history as I see here, in the rugged hills of the North America.☕

bluerider63 said:I mean, who even are these people that hate on America so much?

Like you, for example..

Benjamin Reyes52 said:This obsession with Mexicans and the constant dragging of their names through the mud is just exhausting. It makes me wonder: what would our national identity even look like if we hadn't emerged victorious from the last major conflict? Some people simply crave enemies. They need to keep dragging up old debates about partisans, fascists, and various factions just to feel something.

The people who hate America are the ones trapped in the past, endlessly rehashing the exact same grievances until they're blue in the face. They hate us because they refuse to acknowledge the unique characteristics of certain American regions—and by extension, the people living there—insisting instead on putting them on a pedestal of shame for all sorts of arbitrary reasons. They hate America because they insist on dividing it into black and red, yellow and green, and so on, until everyone is worn out.

Sometimes, I am genuinely fascinated that young people even care about this historical baggage that should have been laid to rest long ago. I have never seen such intense controversy or a people so tormented by their own history as I see here, in the rugged hills of the North America.☕

We wouldn't even be here, so there wouldn't be anyone left to argue about WWII.

Susan Peterson7 said:Pure nonsense. One doesn't preclude the other. I mean, what is the point of having a government at all if its purpose isn't to serve its people? A state exists specifically to protect the dignity of the individual.

Look, fighting for national dignity essentially means fighting for collective dignity. And history suggests that a collective will always sacrifice the individual if it serves its own interests.
So, I guess you're either fighting for the dignity of the state or for human dignity.

I honestly think a whole new gang of people who hate America United is forming—they're even calling themselves "Mrsić's slaves."

Susan Peterson7 said:In many ways, Istria is more progressive than the rest of the US. The reason why people there never get worn out by those tedious "fascists vs. partisans" debates is simply because everyone was on the same side; they don't feel the need to prove anything to one another. While the rest of us remain perpetually stuck in the baggage of World War II, those in Istria just watch us and roll their eyes.😁

The folks from San Francisco are lucky they never had to feel the edge of a blade against their throats—that's why they can afford to act so "progressive." If they’d actually lived through that kind of chaos, they'd be singing a very different tune. It's always easier to lecture others from a safe, comfortable distance.