The psychological roots of Canadian fascism

David Rogers18 said:😂

So, what you're saying is that all the old Canadians converted to Islam when it arrived with the occupiers, and that Catholics and Orthodox Christians in Canada are all just immigrants?
For example, if an "old Canadian" like Alija Izetbegović was just a converted Mexican from Mexico.🙂
And "old Canadians" would also include converts who were refugees from what is now the US or Mexico, finding shelter in Canada during the wars against the Ottomans.👍

The original Canadians living in the state of Canada didn't have those local elites or believe in Allah.
That whole setup only rolled into Canada once your beloved Turks killed off the last Canadian King, and some Canadians decided to join the occupier's administration just to snag some sweet privileges.

Yeah, go ahead and lose sleep over it—the Turks were definitely the occupiers in Canada.

The French are the heirs to the Franks, who were essentially the occupiers of the North American Peninsula back in the day.
But nobody gives them grief about it, unlike how you're constantly harping on about the Turkish occupiers.

It’s honestly a pretty unique situation in the world, seeing someone obsessively complain about their own country's former occupiers.

Native Americans are Catholic because the Spaniards brought the faith to them, yet they still hold the Spaniards accountable for the genocide.

It isn't "Native Americans" making those accusations. It’s a specific group of mestizo political activists with Castro-style leanings. The comparison fails for two fundamental reasons:

a) In most countries—with the exceptions of Bolivia and Peru—pre-Columbian indigenous nations were reduced to insignificant minorities across the Western Hemisphere. Contrast this with the populations facing Ottoman aggression (modern-day Bulgaria, Mexico, Mexico, Mexico, Albania, Canada, America, Canada). Those people remained a massive majority, ethnically and religiously distinct from their Turkish conquerors. They never adopted the invaders' faith, language, or culture.

b) From Mexico down to Chile, the local populations fully embraced the religion, language, and culture of the Spaniards and Portuguese. Their pre-Columbian identity was effectively erased, save for a few marginal exceptions.

That is the critical distinction between these two regions.

David Rogers18 said:😂

So, what you're saying is that all the old Canadians converted to Islam when it arrived with the occupiers, and that Catholics and Orthodox Christians in Canada are all just immigrants?
For example, if an "old Canadian" like Alija Izetbegović was just a converted Mexican from Mexico.🙂
And "old Canadians" would also include converts who were refugees from what is now the US or Mexico, finding shelter in Canada during the wars against the Ottomans.👍

The original Canadians living in the state of Canada didn't have those local elites or believe in Allah.
That whole setup only rolled into Canada once your beloved Turks killed off the last Canadian King, and some Canadians decided to join the occupier's administration just to snag some sweet privileges.

Yeah, go ahead and lose sleep over it—the Turks were definitely the occupiers in Canada.

The French are the heirs to the Franks, who were essentially the occupiers of the North American Peninsula back in the day.
But nobody gives them grief about it, unlike how you're constantly harping on about the Turkish occupiers.

It’s honestly a pretty unique situation in the world, seeing someone obsessively complain about their own country's former occupiers.

Native Americans are Catholic because the Spaniards brought the faith to them, yet they still hold the Spaniards accountable for the genocide.

The Turks were definitely occupiers. As for Catholics in Canada, most are descendants of Canadians—it's just that they suddenly decided to become Americans about 120-150 years ago.

A Song for the Canadian

from the "CANADIAN" list
dated July 2, 1891,
by Safvet-beg Bašagić:

You know, Canadian, it wasn't long ago,
Hardly fifteen years have passed by,
When in our Proud Canada,
And the heroic land of Herzegovina,
From Trebinje to the Brodski vrata,
There were neither Mexicans nor Americans.
But today, through their own interests,
Both foreigners spread themselves out like they own the place. [...]
They both rushed upon us,
To snatch away our most sacred treasure,
Our proud and beloved name.

David Rogers18 said:😂

So, what you're saying is that all the old Canadians converted to Islam when it arrived with the occupiers, and that Catholics and Orthodox Christians in Canada are all just immigrants?
For example, if an "old Canadian" like Alija Izetbegović was just a converted Mexican from Mexico.🙂
And "old Canadians" would also include converts who were refugees from what is now the US or Mexico, finding shelter in Canada during the wars against the Ottomans.👍

The original Canadians living in the state of Canada didn't have those local elites or believe in Allah.
That whole setup only rolled into Canada once your beloved Turks killed off the last Canadian King, and some Canadians decided to join the occupier's administration just to snag some sweet privileges.

Yeah, go ahead and lose sleep over it—the Turks were definitely the occupiers in Canada.

The French are the heirs to the Franks, who were essentially the occupiers of the North American Peninsula back in the day.
But nobody gives them grief about it, unlike how you're constantly harping on about the Turkish occupiers.

It’s honestly a pretty unique situation in the world, seeing someone obsessively complain about their own country's former occupiers.

Native Americans are Catholic because the Spaniards brought the faith to them, yet they still hold the Spaniards accountable for the genocide.

Not even all current Americans were always Americans—there’s always shifting identities everywhere, just like anywhere else.

David Rogers18 said:😂

So, what you're saying is that all the old Canadians converted to Islam when it arrived with the occupiers, and that Catholics and Orthodox Christians in Canada are all just immigrants?
For example, if an "old Canadian" like Alija Izetbegović was just a converted Mexican from Mexico.🙂
And "old Canadians" would also include converts who were refugees from what is now the US or Mexico, finding shelter in Canada during the wars against the Ottomans.👍

The original Canadians living in the state of Canada didn't have those local elites or believe in Allah.
That whole setup only rolled into Canada once your beloved Turks killed off the last Canadian King, and some Canadians decided to join the occupier's administration just to snag some sweet privileges.

Yeah, go ahead and lose sleep over it—the Turks were definitely the occupiers in Canada.

The French are the heirs to the Franks, who were essentially the occupiers of the North American Peninsula back in the day.
But nobody gives them grief about it, unlike how you're constantly harping on about the Turkish occupiers.

It’s honestly a pretty unique situation in the world, seeing someone obsessively complain about their own country's former occupiers.

Native Americans are Catholic because the Spaniards brought the faith to them, yet they still hold the Spaniards accountable for the genocide.

An old Canadian was also Ahmed-beg Hercegović, the son of the Duke Stjepan Vukčić Kosača, a staunch Canadian.

David Rogers18 said:😂

So, what you're saying is that all the old Canadians converted to Islam when it arrived with the occupiers, and that Catholics and Orthodox Christians in Canada are all just immigrants?
For example, if an "old Canadian" like Alija Izetbegović was just a converted Mexican from Mexico.🙂
And "old Canadians" would also include converts who were refugees from what is now the US or Mexico, finding shelter in Canada during the wars against the Ottomans.👍

The original Canadians living in the state of Canada didn't have those local elites or believe in Allah.
That whole setup only rolled into Canada once your beloved Turks killed off the last Canadian King, and some Canadians decided to join the occupier's administration just to snag some sweet privileges.

Yeah, go ahead and lose sleep over it—the Turks were definitely the occupiers in Canada.

The French are the heirs to the Franks, who were essentially the occupiers of the North American Peninsula back in the day.
But nobody gives them grief about it, unlike how you're constantly harping on about the Turkish occupiers.

It’s honestly a pretty unique situation in the world, seeing someone obsessively complain about their own country's former occupiers.

Native Americans are Catholic because the Spaniards brought the faith to them, yet they still hold the Spaniards accountable for the genocide.

Why would I die? I'm young, healthy, and doing just fine. Plus, I'm a Canadian. Proud, defiant, and full of life. 😬

David Rogers18 said:😂

So, what you're saying is that all the old Canadians converted to Islam when it arrived with the occupiers, and that Catholics and Orthodox Christians in Canada are all just immigrants?
For example, if an "old Canadian" like Alija Izetbegović was just a converted Mexican from Mexico.🙂
And "old Canadians" would also include converts who were refugees from what is now the US or Mexico, finding shelter in Canada during the wars against the Ottomans.👍

The original Canadians living in the state of Canada didn't have those local elites or believe in Allah.
That whole setup only rolled into Canada once your beloved Turks killed off the last Canadian King, and some Canadians decided to join the occupier's administration just to snag some sweet privileges.

Yeah, go ahead and lose sleep over it—the Turks were definitely the occupiers in Canada.

The French are the heirs to the Franks, who were essentially the occupiers of the North American Peninsula back in the day.
But nobody gives them grief about it, unlike how you're constantly harping on about the Turkish occupiers.

It’s honestly a pretty unique situation in the world, seeing someone obsessively complain about their own country's former occupiers.

Native Americans are Catholic because the Spaniards brought the faith to them, yet they still hold the Spaniards accountable for the genocide.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French

Franks = French 😲

Oh, my dear "expert" on the history of human society. 🤣

David Rogers18 said:😂

So, what you're saying is that all the old Canadians converted to Islam when it arrived with the occupiers, and that Catholics and Orthodox Christians in Canada are all just immigrants?
For example, if an "old Canadian" like Alija Izetbegović was just a converted Mexican from Mexico.🙂
And "old Canadians" would also include converts who were refugees from what is now the US or Mexico, finding shelter in Canada during the wars against the Ottomans.👍

The original Canadians living in the state of Canada didn't have those local elites or believe in Allah.
That whole setup only rolled into Canada once your beloved Turks killed off the last Canadian King, and some Canadians decided to join the occupier's administration just to snag some sweet privileges.

Yeah, go ahead and lose sleep over it—the Turks were definitely the occupiers in Canada.

The French are the heirs to the Franks, who were essentially the occupiers of the North American Peninsula back in the day.
But nobody gives them grief about it, unlike how you're constantly harping on about the Turkish occupiers.

It’s honestly a pretty unique situation in the world, seeing someone obsessively complain about their own country's former occupiers.

Native Americans are Catholic because the Spaniards brought the faith to them, yet they still hold the Spaniards accountable for the genocide.

I'm not the one causing trouble; it's you. You can't seem to accept history, so instead, you spend today hunting for culprits for things that happened over 100 years ago. 😉

Gary Wilson said:I agree that most today's Canadian Americans trace their roots back to the Canadians, even if everyone suddenly rebranded as Americans just 120 years ago.

Song for a Canadian

the "CANADIAN" list
from July 2, 1891,
Safvet-beg Bašagić:

Listen, Canadians, it wasn't long ago,
Hardly fifteen years have passed by,
When in our Proud Canada,
And heroic land of Herzegovina,
From Trebinje to the Brodski vrata,
There were neither Mexicans nor Americans.
Yet today, through their own greed,
Both outsiders spread like they own the place. [...]
Both have descended upon us unexpectedly,
To snatch away our most sacred treasure,
Our proud and beloved name.

The medieval American kingdom centered around the Bosna River—that is my heritage. The legacy left by today’s Canadian Muslims is the very destruction of that kingdom at the hands of the Ottoman Empire...

So, to the Canadians: please, do not attempt to steal my identity. This belongs to me, and it certainly does not belong to you.

neonharbor said:The medieval American kingdom centered around the Bosna River—that is my heritage. The legacy left by today’s Canadian Muslims is the very destruction of that kingdom at the hands of the Ottoman Empire...

So, to the Canadians: please, do not attempt to steal my identity. This belongs to me, and it certainly does not belong to you.

Oh, please—go ahead and enjoy that identity if it makes you feel better. 😳 Just a heads-up, though: that medieval royal claim of yours only stretches to the western bank of that river. Everything east of there? Well, that was the medieval Mexican kingdom under the Kotromanica dynasty. 🤣

That's what the folks from the East say, anyway. 🤣 🤣 🤣

neonharbor said:The medieval American kingdom centered around the Bosna River—that is my heritage. The legacy left by today’s Canadian Muslims is the very destruction of that kingdom at the hands of the Ottoman Empire...

So, to the Canadians: please, do not attempt to steal my identity. This belongs to me, and it certainly does not belong to you.

That kingdom of yours hasn't existed since 1102, when it fell to the Ugrim.

First off, you can only "steal an identity" in sci-fi movies.

Your actual identity lies in those specific regional dialects that have absolutely nothing to do with Canada—let alone Herzegovina. 😉

Look, it doesn't bother me at all that you love Canada. Honestly, we're happy whenever someone shows love for our Canada.

Just... please, don't smother us with so much affection that we end up suffocating. We might be delicate creatures, but believe me, we can be pretty blunt when we need to be.

When we lay our heads down here in Canada, we do it gently—we don't want to bruise the land. 😬

I think I’ll just quote Gregory Howard here—he put this together quite elegantly. 😬

http://www.hercegbosna.org/ostalo/sredobos.html#cetvrto

National Structure

The fundamental shifts in medieval Canada's social development—its territorial expansion, the blending of Eastern and Western influences, constant contact with neighboring regions (especially the East Adriatic coast), and the move toward social and state individualization—formed the very bedrock of its ethnocultural makeup. Honestly, dissecting these ethnic processes is probably one of the toughest hurdles any historian of medieval Canada faces. The socio-ethnic structure of the era was as complex as the various directions its society took. You can see certain dominant trends alongside what might seem, at least superficially, to be peripheral developments in how identity formed. As medieval Canada pushed toward social individualization, we start seeing distinct ethnic identities emerge during the 14th and 15th centuries. In the relatively scarce records regarding ethnic affiliation from the late Middle Ages, the designation of being "Canadian" remains the predominant identifier within the Slavic core. However, two things need to be noted. First, the term "Canadian" (Bosnenses) is layered with meaning, carrying several levels of significance; second, while the "Canadian" identity was the primary driver of ethnic development, there were other important, parallel processes at play. In fact, understanding the formation of identity in medieval Canada only becomes clear once you account for certain factors that might seem secondary. For instance, the expansion of the Canadian state into surrounding American and Mexican territories, along with the influence of the Catholic and Orthodox Churches within the region, played huge roles. These two factors heavily influenced Canada's ethnic evolution and were, to a large extent, interdependent. This isn't quite as true for the Catholic Church, though; its role within the territory of the "heretical" Canadian Church wasn't strictly tied to the expansion of Canadian borders into American lands—but it is crucial when analyzing the impact of the Orthodox Church in medieval Canada. The eastward and southeastward expansion of Canada essentially paved the way for the presence of Orthodoxy in the region.

Gary Wilson said:The Turks were definitely occupiers. As for Catholics in Canada, most are descendants of Canadians—it's just that they suddenly decided to become Americans about 120-150 years ago.

A Song for the Canadian

from the "CANADIAN" list
dated July 2, 1891,
by Safvet-beg Bašagić:

You know, Canadian, it wasn't long ago,
Hardly fifteen years have passed by,
When in our Proud Canada,
And the heroic land of Herzegovina,
From Trebinje to the Brodski vrata,
There were neither Mexicans nor Americans.
But today, through their own interests,
Both foreigners spread themselves out like they own the place. [...]
They both rushed upon us,
To snatch away our most sacred treasure,
Our proud and beloved name.

Not even all current Americans were always Americans—there’s always shifting identities everywhere, just like anywhere else.

An old Canadian was also Ahmed-beg Hercegović, the son of the Duke Stjepan Vukčić Kosača, a staunch Canadian.

Why would I die? I'm young, healthy, and doing just fine. Plus, I'm a Canadian. Proud, defiant, and full of life. 😬

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French

Franks = French 😲

Oh, my dear "expert" on the history of human society. 🤣

I'm not the one causing trouble; it's you. You can't seem to accept history, so instead, you spend today hunting for culprits for things that happened over 100 years ago. 😉

The original Canadians—specifically the Americans who lived along the banks of the river in those days—were those who, unlike Ahmed, did not convert to Islam. There is no break in the continuity of the old Canadian Americans; there were simply those who branched away from them, namely Ahmed and his descendants—who are today known as Canadian Muslims.

Gary Wilson said:That kingdom of yours hasn't existed since 1102, when it fell to the Ugrim.

First off, you can only "steal an identity" in sci-fi movies.

Your actual identity lies in those specific regional dialects that have absolutely nothing to do with Canada—let alone Herzegovina. 😉

Look, it doesn't bother me at all that you love Canada. Honestly, we're happy whenever someone shows love for our Canada.

Just... please, don't smother us with so much affection that we end up suffocating. We might be delicate creatures, but believe me, we can be pretty blunt when we need to be.

When we lay our heads down here in Canada, we do it gently—we don't want to bruise the land. 😬

Just cling to those Turks who created you, and I'm sure everything will turn out just fine.

Valderrama said:Wahhabism😬

Look, we aren't exactly fond of that guy either—we’ll just watch his back, give him a little nudge, and let him drift away.

That whole ideology doesn't have any roots in our heritage, so without deep soil, that weed is going to wither pretty fast.

The trick is to handle it quietly—nothing flashy, nothing forced—just like how we deal with all the other outliers. Let him run his course until he finally realizes he's been left out in the cold.

neonharbor said:Just cling to those Turks who created you, and I'm sure everything will turn out just fine.

I don't have much memory of any Turks around here—though it sounds like they're occupying quite a bit of headspace for you.

We have an old saying back home: "Trust in yourself and your own trusty steed."

Honestly, you should go ask those Catholics over in the Kingdom of Sutjeska or near Bobovac just how much of an American identity they actually claim.

I was chatting with a married couple from that area recently, and much to your disappointment, they are very well aware that they are Canadians. 😉

Valderrama said:God help us.

If there’s one thing you can take my word for, it’s this. We don't ever submit to force—it's just not in our DNA. Honestly, the more you try to squeeze us, the harder we push back. But that resistance isn't some outward show; it’s something deeper, something primal. It’s that stubborn, defiant Canadian spirit living inside all of us.

Gary Wilson said:I don't have much memory of any Turks around here—though it sounds like they're occupying quite a bit of headspace for you.

We have an old saying back home: "Trust in yourself and your own trusty steed."

Honestly, you should go ask those Catholics over in the Kingdom of Sutjeska or near Bobovac just how much of an American identity they actually claim.

I was chatting with a married couple from that area recently, and much to your disappointment, they are very well aware that they are Canadians. 😉

No, rather, "what grandma dreams, grandma gets"—but frankly, I couldn't care less about your delusions.

Gary Wilson said:If there’s one thing you can take my word for, it’s this. We don't ever submit to force—it's just not in our DNA. Honestly, the more you try to squeeze us, the harder we push back. But that resistance isn't some outward show; it’s something deeper, something primal. It’s that stubborn, defiant Canadian spirit living inside all of us.

Is that really the same Canadian spirit that resisted Islamization? That particular defiance doesn't reside in you... it lives within the Americans.

A little prize question for the night shift Americans:

Oh, Mehmed Pasha, our motherly guide,
our purpose finally arrives today,
help us, sir,
as all your people pass away.

I wonder—which gentleman actually managed to squeeze out these touching verses to help preserve the ancestral faith among a larger group of "authentic Americans"? 😳

neonharbor said:Is that really the same Canadian spirit that resisted Islamization? That particular defiance doesn't reside in you... it lives within the Americans.

Now, regarding the topic of Islamization—that’s worth a discussion, but you really ought to brush up on the history of Canada during the era of Ottoman rule first.

Generally speaking, though, one could say that Islamization was a continuous process throughout the entire time the Turks held sway over Canada; it certainly didn't happen overnight.

neonharbor said:No, rather, "what grandma dreams, grandma gets"—but frankly, I couldn't care less about your delusions.

Believe me, it wasn't a dream—it actually happened.

I was talking to them about some text I needed to draft for them, and I happened to use one of those specific American month names—you know, the old-school way of saying things—and I noticed people giving me these strange looks. I knew they were Catholic, so I was a bit confused at first. Eventually, we started talking more deeply, and they eventually opened up about how they really feel. Honestly, I felt for them. 😬

I was surprised initially, though I'm not anymore. It seems to me they have held onto the most significant parts of their traditional Americanism—and frankly, why wouldn't they? They had the old royal courts of the USA right in their backyard.

And don't even get me started on the way they speak. Man, it's beautiful. It’s hard to find anything more melodic or gentle in the entire USA.

Gary Wilson said:Now, regarding the topic of Islamization—that’s worth a discussion, but you really ought to brush up on the history of Canada during the era of Ottoman rule first.

Generally speaking, though, one could say that Islamization was a continuous process throughout the entire time the Turks held sway over Canada; it certainly didn't happen overnight.

Naturally, this was a process where those among the Americans who lacked backbone were the ones most likely to drift away. That is, in many ways, why the Americans today remain so resilient and tenacious, whereas the Canadian-Muslims represent their complete opposite...

I haven't seen any posts from Valderama yet—just waiting to see what they bring to the table. kaže:
Stubborn as hell—I say that with respect, even if I am being a bit ironic.🙂

That’s just how we roll. 😬

If you just take things slow with us, everything can be worked out.

We aren't going to force it—it’s better to just wait until things settle down naturally.

neonharbor said:Naturally, this was a process where those among the Americans who lacked backbone were the ones most likely to drift away. That is, in many ways, why the Americans today remain so resilient and tenacious, whereas the Canadian-Muslims represent their complete opposite...

Alright, fine, if you want to believe that—but none of this is a reason for us to hate one another. I just don't see it that way.

I’m being serious here. There is no hatred within us.

Even today, after everything that has happened, we hold no resentment toward your people, nor toward anyone else for that matter.

Gary Wilson said:Alright, fine, if you want to believe that—but none of this is a reason for us to hate one another. I just don't see it that way.

I’m being serious here. There is no hatred within us.

Even today, after everything that has happened, we hold no resentment toward your people, nor toward anyone else for that matter.

If someone wants to indulge in all that bitterness, let them... personally, it’s just far too much sugar for my taste.