Posts by urbantinker8

frozenrider15 said:No, that’s not an "extra plus." An extra plus only exists when people have a completely warped view of what school and after-school care actually entail. Look, I’m not saying after-school care is some kind of magical paradise for a kid, but it isn't the absolute catastrophe people make it out to be when they cherry-pick complaints out of context.

In a perfect world? My ideal scenario would be for parents to hang out with their kids after school. They’d eat a home-cooked meal, take a breather, knock out the homework while Mom and Dad double-check it, and spend the rest of the day just playing. Simple. Clean.

But let's be real—that isn't happening for most families. After-school programs don't look repulsive to me, and they certainly aren't a reason to delay starting school any later than we already do.

I think I'm on the exact same page as you here.
I honestly don't see how having an after-school program would somehow support the idea of pushing back school start ages?😕
I mean, by the time a kid is seven and a half, they're usually much more independent and responsible, so maybe they could just hang out at home for half the day and wouldn't even need the program anymore?🤷

Karen Richardson3 said:Back when I was growing up, school used to offer these two totally different setups: full-day programs or after-school care.

The full-day option was this specific way they organized everything where you’d basically have two different teachers looking after the class, and the schedule was all mixed up—like, you’d have an hour of actual lessons, then an hour of playtime, then back to a lesson, and so on.

Then there was the after-school thing, which was more just hanging out in the classroom once the regular school day wrapped up; you'd be with whatever teacher was on duty, just grinding through homework and stuff.

I ended up being in the full-day program for my first four years of elementary school (though even then, I’d still beat my parents home most days, since they wouldn't get back until around 5:00 PM and my grandma lived way across town—I'm guessing that was pretty unusual back then, because whenever I read these old threads, everyone talks about how their parents were pulling into the driveway by 3:00, but mine definitely weren't 😁).

Honestly though, I wonder if anyone even does that old-school full-day style anymore?

Probably not.

I suppose I’m just gauging my availability based on a few other commitments I have lined up.🤣

Congrats!

rowdypanther12 said:She should just be upfront at the parent meeting and say she doesn't teach languages, and that's that. If the kids want to do the work themselves later, or with their parents—or if they just don't do it at all—that's on them.
If a kid is in an after-school program for five-year-olds and they're expected to finish language homework there, that seems really strange to me.

And I guess she probably tells them that parents might just breeze through it or forget entirely, and then everyone ends up arguing about it later.
That kind of thing happens all the time, I think.🙂

Karen Richardson3 said:What really gets under my skin is seeing parents obsess over the syllabus instead of actually focusing on their kid (and themselves).

The curriculum is what it is. There will always be some kids who find it a breeze and others who struggle to keep up. It's just how it works because some kids are naturally more driven toward academics while others are clearly destined for sports, music, or working with their hands.

In my opinion, the real issue today isn't the coursework; it's that kids—at least from what I hear—are having major concentration issues because they're glued to the TV. Plus, a huge number of them are left unsupervised on computers because their parents aren't tech-savvy at all. So, the parents think their kid is studying just because the room is quiet, which is pretty naive—I mean, I've seen it myself, and I used to fall for that logic too, thinking everyone was on the same page, but I'm making sure my kid won't even have a computer in their bedroom until they hit high school.🤣 )

Then you run into these authority issues, which probably stems from that whole mindset you see everywhere online: "Oh, if I raise my voice at my precious little one, will they be traumatized and end up hating me? I just want them to grow up to be perfect little beings who love me forever as the ultimate mother."🙂
(Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you should go around yelling at kids constantly, but we need to raise them to understand they aren't the center of the universe. We shouldn't be walking on eggshells around them, terrified that setting a boundary or expecting them to listen without a meltdown will somehow damage their psyche.)

And once again, 🙏 🙏 🙏

It looks like you've found plenty of inspiration to react to while you were away from the forum .🤣

rowdypanther12 said:Plus, it means the kid comes home from after-school care having actually learned something because someone sat down and explained things, rather than just grinding through homework alone.

I suppose, eventually, that kind of support tends to get scaled back or becomes much more limited in scope.
It really all comes down to how the teacher decides to frame the situation, I guess.

Come on, give us a little credit here; it’s not like we all dropped out of school without a clue about basic pedagogy or how kids learn.
What you're describing is something parents are actively doing, I'm fairly certain, rather than anything the after-school staff is handling.

rowdypanther12 said:What does it mean if my child can only attend classes taught in English, simply because both my spouse and I only speak English? There isn't anyone at home who could help her with German, and honestly, it shouldn't matter whether she's studying in a park, at home, or in an after-school program.

It isn't really the same thing, I suppose.
If she’s just playing in the park or hanging out at home, nobody is actually being paid to teach your child anything.
But an instructor in an after-school program, for instance, is actually tasked with making sure homework is properly explained and completed correctly.
Because, you know, I imagine if a parent were to find out—and God forbid this happens more than once—that a teacher miscommunicated something regarding a foreign language assignment they don't personally understand, leading to kids getting their work wrong... well, I think people would lose their minds.😲
Heads would probably roll.☕

Susan James said:No way—homework usually takes maybe thirty minutes at most. The rest of the time should be all about play and having fun!

Well, yeah, I suppose, but my point is that the assignment actually needs to be graded correctly, and how is a teacher supposed to know if a Spanish assignment was done perfectly if they don't speak a single word of Spanish themselves?🤷
Doing homework during after-school programs shouldn't just be some formality or a way to kill time; there has to be some actual substance to it.

I’m talking about after-school care in general here, not just specifically for first graders.
I suspect that any foreign language curriculum used in first grade would likely be manageable even for a teacher who wasn't formally trained in it.
Especially since, at that level, everything mostly boils down to drawing pictures and practicing basic vocabulary anyway.

rowdypanther12 said:I'm not quite following what you're getting at here 🤷
as if a kid could actually get their homework done before after-school care ends at 4:00.

No, I’m actually just responding to what you said about why they don't finish their language arts homework, since the teacher isn't the one doing the work for them anyway.
Look, rowdypanther12 is actually in after-school care right now, so maybe they can give you a better idea of how things actually play out there.
When they're working on assignments, they're usually talking through the material with the teacher; the teacher explains things if something seems fuzzy, everyone asks their own specific questions, and if the instructor notices that most of the class is struggling with a particular concept, they'll try to go over it more thoroughly to make sure it clicks.
So, what happens if she doesn't speak French, but the kids happen to have French homework?
Should we just give them thirty minutes to struggle through it entirely on their own, without any guidance or oversight, just so parents don't have to deal with it once the school day ends?🤷

And obviously, after-school programs are about way more than just sitting there grinding through homework—I mean, rowdypanther12 could probably tell you all about everything else they do during those few hours.

rowdypanther12 said:Actually, they are required to write it down.😁

I agree about the homework, though; if they're in after-school care, there shouldn't be much left to do at home. That said, I know sometimes if a kid has language arts homework, they're told they have to do it at home because of some silly argument that the after-school teacher isn't a "language expert."
😕
I don't really get why the teacher needs to be an expert in the subject; it's the student doing the work, not her.🤷

Honestly, I'm just not sure how everyone envisions this after-school program working out.😁
Do you really think the instructor just sits there at their desk for four hours, lost in their own world, while a room full of kids works frantically on assignments without a single break?

Karen Richardson3 said:Honestly, I don't get why everyone treats starting school like it's some tragic end to childhood or something..
whereas I totally vibe with what summer was saying about worrying if their kid is just going to be stuck at home all day.

but yeah, generally speaking, we tend to turn everything into a massive drama when it comes to those "enlightened" parents.

And don't even get me started on all these posts complaining about how overwhelmed first graders are. If parents actually had the guts to just shut off the PC and the TV, I bet they’d find plenty of time for everything, including playing outside for a bit. Kids over five aren't missing out on parks because of their schoolwork; it's because they're glued to screens, playing video games and liking duck face selfies on Facebook.

P.S. "I'm chasing my career," says mom 🤣 I tried to cut back on the forums, but since I'm clearly terrible at self-control, I just banned myself until I finished everything I needed to get done.

I completely agree.
Honestly, let's just hope some of these overachievers decide to take their talents elsewhere instead of clogging up the system.😁

Susan James said:I'm planning on using after-school programs too, and honestly, I won't stress over it. I'll just request that all the schoolwork gets completed while they're actually at school.
By the way, do they still push for nap times in after-school programs? (I remember that being a thing back in my elementary school days here in the States)

On another note, regarding things like addresses, birthdays, and phone numbers—I actually see that as part of "school readiness." It's important for them to know who their parents are and where they live, so if they ever get lost, they can actually tell someone who they are.
They might not need to be able to write it all out perfectly yet, but they definitely should be able to say it out loud.

What do you mean, napping in after-school care?🤣
That hasn't been a thing for twenty years, if not longer.

I mean, seriously, what are we even talking about here?
Address, full name, and the parents' names—my little guy has known all of that since he was two and a half, so I'm not quite sure why there's such a fuss.
I imagine by the time they start kindergarten, they'll probably have their birthday and phone number down too; we've got about three and a half years left, so I guess we'll manage to learn it by then.😳

I think everyone is overthinking this.☕

I guess I should probably start by saying that I’ve been thinking about this for quite a while now, though I haven't really known how to put it into words until just this moment. It’s funny how things work out that way, isn't it? I was sitting there yesterday, just staring at my screen, and it hit me—well, it didn't exactly hit me like a lightning bolt, more like a slow realization that drifted in like a fog over the Hudson River. Anyway, regarding what Karen Richardson3 mentioned earlier... I don't know, maybe she's onto something, or maybe I'm just overthinking it again. I tend to do that. I find myself getting lost in the weeds of these discussions, wondering if we're all looking at the same picture or if we're all just staring at different pieces of a puzzle that doesn't actually exist. It feels like we spend so much time debating the small stuff when the bigger picture is just sort of hovering there, waiting for us to notice it. Or perhaps it isn't waiting. Perhaps it’s just indifferent. That’s a bit grim, I suppose, but I can't help but feel that way sometimes. I was reading this article the other day—I think it was from a tech blog based out of San Francisco—about how our perceptions are shaped by the very tools we use to communicate, and it made me wonder if our conversation here is being subtly steered by those same digital currents. It’s a strange thought, I realize. A bit rambly, even. But I think it’s worth considering, even if we don't reach any grand conclusions. We might just end up right back where we started, which, honestly, wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.

Karen Richardson3 I guess what they're saying is... I was born right around the start of the 1980s, and I remember back then the rule was that kids born by March 31st were basically required to start school, which I suppose felt pretty standard at the time. But now, there’s all this talk about moving that cutoff date up to September 1st, which would mean children end up starting their schooling much earlier than they used to. It makes me wonder how that shift will actually play out in the long run, though I guess everything changes eventually. I was born right at the tail end of March, which I suppose meant I started school a little early, around six and a half years old. I never really gave it much thought at the time, honestly; I never found myself sitting there wondering how many kids in my class were older or younger than me, though looking back, it’s pretty obvious that almost everyone else was a bit further along. My sister was born right at the start of May, and I guess she didn't quite make the cut during the testing for that early childhood program—you know, the one for kids around six and a half. That last year of preschool was honestly such a mess, mostly because she just wouldn't stop crying about how bored she was. Her mom used to leave her home by herself quite often—and look, I get it, I’m probably not the best judge here, but I remember playing all alone in the park when I wasn't even three yet while my mom just watched from the balcony. I actually ended up getting hit in the head with a swing once, but back then, I guess it was just considered normal for kids to get a few scrapes or bleed a little. It wasn't like today, where people act like you're going to lose your parental rights or end up in some state-run daycare center just because a kid gets a bruise. 😁 I mean, I guess my sister was always a bit different, like she basically taught herself how to read just by obsessively studying the elementary school curriculum, and if she had actually gone to preschool, she probably would have spent the whole time sitting there reading picture books to everyone else instead of playing. So, yeah, when you think about it, summer can actually be a bit of a drag for kids in preschool, I guess. It’s funny how we always assume they’re just going to be running around having the time of their lives, but there’s definitely a chance things get pretty tedious for them in that setting. 🙂 I guess looking back at my own school days, things haven't really changed that much, though it feels like we talk about it differently now. There were always those kids who just couldn't quite wrap their heads around reading, even by the time they hit fifth grade, and there were others whose parents would go out and buy them a bike just to celebrate them passing a grade, which seems a bit much, I suppose. It was a mix of everything, really, much like what you see today, and I suspect those parents probably felt the exact same way—convinced that the curriculum was just too demanding or that the teachers were asking for the impossible. I guess there’s just a constant stream of school kids on my street lately, always running around outside playing, though if they aren't out there, they're usually glued to Facebook—I mean, we all hang out together in our neighborhood circles, so I tend to know exactly what everyone is up to. I don't know if this comes off as a bit harsh, or maybe just blunt, but I suppose you could have seen it coming with most of those kids; before they even stepped foot into an American classroom, you could pretty much make an educated guess about what kind of students they were going to be. 😁 I suppose, in any given situation, if a parent is feeling that intense level of anxiety—that gut feeling that their kid just isn't ready for the classroom yet—it might actually be a better move to look into deferring enrollment for a year. I mean, it’s probably worth considering whether it’s more beneficial to ask for a delay rather than letting the child pick up on all that underlying tension or a negative attitude from the parent regarding school in general. It seems like that kind of stress could really rub off on them, which might not be ideal for their transition. I suppose it’s unlikely that anyone will actually want to stop playing just because they’ve headed off to school, especially since there’s always going to be something new and genuinely interesting to learn or get involved with once they get settled in.

🙏🙏🙏
Well, hello there—where have you been hiding? I feel like I haven’t seen you in an entire century, or maybe it just feels that way because life has been so busy lately.😁

I guess I don't quite wrap my head around why parents get so worked up before their kids even start school, worrying that they’re somehow losing their chance to just be kids, or acting like they're being drafted straight into the military instead of just heading into a classroom.🤷
I suppose we have to accept that things won't work quite the same way anymore, where kids can just spend the entire day playing exactly like they did back in preschool, though I guess there is still this ongoing push in the elementary school system to incorporate more play-based learning into the curriculum, much like what you see in those early childhood programs.
Whether it’s before school or after, depending on how their schedule shakes out, there is still plenty of time for kids to just go out and play. It isn't like they're sitting in first grade being forced to tackle something heavy like *Crime and Punishment* for homework the second they walk through the door, leaving them no chance to hit up the local park or anything.🤷
I suppose a six-year-old might be reaching that stage where they just need some fresh challenges, you know? It feels like they’re ready to start developing a bit more of a sense of independence, maybe even a little more responsibility when it comes to their own "obligations" around the house. I guess it’s about finding that balance between letting them fly and keeping things organized.

It’s actually kind of funny to me, something I’ve been noticing for years now: you have these parents who make such a massive, exhausting scene about enrolling their kids in preschool, complaining about every little thing from the curriculum to how they handle potty training, but then, once the kid hits six, suddenly they want to keep them in daycare for as long as possible and start this whole identical, overwhelming drama all over again regarding elementary school enrollment.
I suppose the whole cycle of intense drama just keeps going when it comes to high school, and honestly, it probably doesn't even taper off when they start applying for college.🤣

Brian Barnes5 said:That’s all I was getting at. I haven't lived it myself, but from everything I see with people close to me, it’s pretty much always like this.
The burden falls on the parent to check the homework, but if a parent is working a standard 8-to-4 shift, that work has to be finished in the afternoon or evening for them to actually help. When a kid is stuck in school until 5:30 PM, they barely have a second to breathe or decompress before they’re expected to dive straight into writing, reading, reviewing, and drills...
urbantinker8, I wasn't suggesting that teachers are the ones setting their own schedules. I have no clue who pulls those strings, but it feels like whoever is making those calls isn't exactly putting the needs of the little ones first. But hey, let's not get sidetracked—we can circle back to that later or just leave it alone, regardless of how the shifts are set up.

It’s honestly a bit disheartening to see such a widespread sentiment that everything happening in our schools is being done at the expense of the kids just to make things easier for the staff.😢
And I guess that kind of mindset doesn't really help anyone, does it?

@frozenrider15
Of course they do.
I think I’m in complete agreement here.
And that’s probably why I feel like nobody should be playing the villain starting in first grade—not the parents, not the kids, and certainly not the teachers.
Everything just tends to settle into its natural rhythm over time, I suppose, provided that everyone just focuses on doing their own little part of the "job."🙂

Chris Kim16 said:I'm also glad it hasn't been too tough for me.
I rarely use public transit, but I agree—it would be nice. It doesn't bother me much right now, though; I'm sure that'll change once things get physically demanding.
But I totally get that some women feel terrible regardless of how big their bump is—sometimes you just have to get things done. My first three or four months were a total disaster, even before anyone could tell I was pregnant, so I definitely have empathy for those who are struggling. Besides, I had these issues before I was even pregnant. It's really just about manners—some people just don't have them.

It seems like more and more people are losing that sense of decency, unfortunately.

It isn't about gender or age, or really anything else, I guess.
Most people just act like they fell off a cliff or something, acting completely oblivious and only looking out for themselves.😢

When I have to head into the city, I usually only go for the most essential stuff—like hitting up the bank, doctor appointments, or quick errands—so, unfortunately, I'm stuck relying on the bus or the subway.

Chris Kim16 said:I have to admit—I’m definitely not feeling "pregnant" yet—and it actually bugs me when I notice people staring at my stomach. Honestly, things like cutting in line or being given special treatment don't even cross my mind. Since I don't even view myself as pregnant right now, why should anyone else?
I assume I might change my tune toward the end, but for now, I really can't say that anything is difficult.

It’s great that you aren't struggling.👍
Still, I think it would be perfectly fine if someone just asked whether you wanted to grab a seat on the subway or if you'd rather stand in front of them when they spot your bump...
And if you don't want to sit, you can just tell them you're fine standing for all five stops.

For me, though, things are, well, extremely difficult; both of my pregnancies have been high-risk, and I've basically been on strict bed rest since day one.
I can't really stand up or walk around properly. 😢
I’d probably bet my kidney on getting a seat on the bus, but I’m still civilized enough not to force people out of their seats on public transit. 🙂

Richard Morris43 said:urbantinker8 🙏.. Honestly, I’m crossing my fingers for a scenario where he actually grinds through his homework in maybe twenty minutes on his own. There's just no point in us stepping in and doing the work for him, right? That's basically just setting him up to fail later on by doing him a massive disservice.

As far as the money side of things goes, we’re already shelling out $233 for daycare, so we won't even blink at the school supplies and stuff.

I guess at the very beginning, while a kid is still getting used to the whole school thing and settling into a new routine, you definitely want to encourage them and offer help whenever you feel it's necessary.
That period might probably last a bit longer than just 15 or 20 minutes, too.
But I think a parent has to figure out when enough is enough, making sure that sitting down to do homework together doesn't turn into a habit for either the parent or the child, because kids often start to take advantage of that, or—which I think is actually much worse—they end up genuinely believing they can't actually get through an assignment without Mom or Dad helping out.

Homework shouldn't really be serving as this big, all-day "activity" for the entire family, though unfortunately, that seems to be how it often turns out.
And then this whole group effort approach starts feeling like a chore for everyone involved, both the kids and the parents.

It feels like basic courtesy has pretty much vanished from our social fabric entirely.😢

I mean, I can’t help but think about how incredibly rude and awkward it would feel if I didn't step aside at the checkout line. Like, if a pregnant woman, a mom with a toddler, or even just an elderly person shows up with maybe two items while I'm standing there with a massive overflowing cart full of groceries, it seems only right to let them go first, doesn't it?
Or, I guess, the idea of just sitting there on the subway like some oblivious cowboy, staring blankly out the window while a heavily pregnant woman stands right next to me struggling with all her shopping bags... it just feels wrong.

But honestly, I find it hard to believe that people aren't actually being sincere when they act this way.🤮

Brian Barnes5 said:I haven't heard of a single first grader being able to knock out their homework without a parent right there by their side, let alone doing it in just 15-20 minutes—and I know plenty of them.
It actually worries me that teacher nightfall is concerned, because she's seen firsthand how these things actually play out in the classroom... 😉

Teachers don't run the whole operation, but whoever is in charge definitely looks out for their comfort. They try to have everyone come in during the morning, but sometimes it's impossible because the building is just packed. And why is it that the little kids always seem to have afternoon sessions while the older ones are stuck in the morning? Is it just because it's easier for the staff? It doesn't make any sense to me... but it’s pretty much standard practice in most American schools.

Look, I’ve been working in the school system for thirteen years now—both elementary and high school—so I can tell you quite confidently, based on actual experience, that what you're saying doesn't really hold water.😉
Do you honestly believe that anyone—whether it's the Secretary of Education, the principal, or the district superintendent—teachers actually gets asked when they would prefer to work??🤣
For instance, if it were up to me, I'd love to work mid-day since I'm definitely not a morning person, and being stuck at a school until 8 PM is just too much. But who am I supposed to talk to about that?😳

It's all over the place.☕

Why shouldn't a first grader do their homework by themselves?😕
The whole idea behind homework is for the student to do the work, while the parent just stays close enough to double-check things or explain a concept if something seems confusing.
We shouldn't treat children like they're completely incapable.
Any kid with average intelligence should be able to handle their assignments solo, no matter the subject.
Your job is basically just to verify that everything was done correctly, and that's pretty much it.
Otherwise, you'll be stuck doing their homework with them until eighth grade, and after that, various tutors will just take over your role anyway.

Brian Barnes5 said:One way to flip the script would be to schedule the first two sessions in the morning and then move the third and fourth ones to the afternoon. Especially since those big groups from 5th to 8th grade only ever happen in the AM—it feels less like we're prioritizing what kids actually need and more like we're just catering to whatever is most convenient for the teachers.
It’s kind of like how some cities go all out on fancy water fountains, while our local landmark is that statue of Franjo Harmon.🙂 Sure, maybe it costs a bit less, but you still have to wonder... 🙄

🙄🙄🙄

I mean, where on earth did you get the idea that teachers are the ones calling the shots on how school schedules are organized?🤦
You really can read just about anything on these forums, I guess.☕

And I have one question: why is everyone so obsessed with exactly when and how you'll be sitting down to help your kid with their homework?😕
Homework has always been tied to what’s being taught in class and tailored to a child's age, so I don't really see why a parent would need to be hovering over every single assignment day and night. Kids eventually need to learn how to handle responsibilities, and that includes figuring out how to get their homework done on their own and on time.
Of course, a parent should be there to clarify things if something isn't clicking or maybe just double-check that everything was handled correctly.
But that really shouldn't take more than maybe 15 or 20 minutes a day.🤷

Dana Brown8 said:So you're telling me you actually held it for him? If it were me, he'd be waiting forever... what, did you learn that polite nonsense in some fancy suburb?
I'm 36 weeks pregnant and I'm still waiting for someone to actually let me go first in a line... pretty sure I'll deliver before that ever happens. 😁

Yeeeeeees.🙂😵🙂🙂

I guess I just didn't really know what to do about the juice situation, if that makes any sense.🤦