So, I had this little scene unfold at my local CVS this morning. Basically, right at the exit, I—carrying a metric ton of stuff, including two heavy bags, a tote, and an umbrella, plus having a bit of a belly myself—bumped right into him (this massive guy, probably pushing 260 lbs, mid-forties, just holding a single beer) and the absolute nerve of the guy just standing there waiting for me to hold the door open for him!!!😲😲😲
I mean, honestly, where is the civility heading these days???🙂
And then, of course, he had the audacity to say thanks at the end.🙂
Richard Morris43 said:And trust me on this one, I really do😵 :panic-mode:
Honestly, so many people just flat-out ignore what the experts say, and they'll tell me that every single kid is somehow "ready" whenever it suits them.
Don't sweat it too much. I mean, if the teacher is actually decent, everything will probably turn out just fine.😉
Richard Morris43 said:nosorog, he’s actually super engaged, you know? He’s constantly filling out these little worksheets with me and showing interest—sometimes even too much, if I’m being honest. He loves it when I read to him, explain things, or give him little challenges to solve. He’s already decided he’s going to school, though; he’s spending the whole summer at our beach house and then heading straight into class this fall, or at least that’s what he tells everyone. The preschool psychologist actually mentioned that intellectually, he’s performing right at a seven-year-old level, but emotionally and socially? He’s just not there yet. That’s why I was leaning toward holding him back for another year. Look, I’m no expert, I’m just a total worrier, and I honestly thought he might struggle to fit in 🤷
blindiran, I honestly have no idea how your experience even relates to what we’re talking about here. Like, does it really matter that you were the youngest in your class? My husband started school about six or seven months early, and he never dealt with any bullying—there were always kids even younger than him in the mix. Meanwhile, I knew one kid who was the oldest in his group and he was basically a walking target for teasing. It feels pretty stupid to generalize everything, doesn't it? And I have to say, kids these days seem way more brutal than they used to be.
The only thing I can think of that might actually mess with him is what ethan brought up—that stuff about hearing things from friends later on once puberty hits and everything gets complicated...
To be honest, I’m a little confused about why you're worrying so much about enrollment and whether he'll fit in. At first, I thought you were questioning the professional assessment, because, well, you know your own kid best, and you felt certain he wasn't socially or emotionally ready for a classroom setting. But now you're saying he’s super eager to tackle tasks, that his intellect is ahead of the curve according to the experts, and that he’s actually looking forward to starting. So, I guess, why on earth would you want to keep him in preschool for another full year?😕
Sorry, I think I got a bit lost somewhere in your previous posts.😵
I suppose preschool programs tend to lose a good chunk of their numbers simply because a handful of kids move on to elementary school, and you always end up losing that one "best friend" connection in the process too. By the time a kid hits seven, I guess they probably need to start absorbing different kinds of information and learning certain social rules that just aren't really part of the daycare routine. I’m certainly not saying we should drop the mandatory school age down to five like they do in some other countries, but then again, I don't really think a seven-year-old should spend their entire day just playing in a preschool setting either.
frozenrider15 said:Here’s the breakdown, though it’s not really the main point:
- Not every kid walks into kindergarten knowing how to read, but man, it would be incredibly helpful if they could at least recognize the first and last sounds in a word, or handle basic phonemic awareness—you know, breaking a word down into sounds and putting them back together. It's all based on listening; they don't need to write a single letter yet, but they really ought to HEAR the sounds.
- As for the heavy vs. light books? I can't say much. The reality is that plenty of books can stay at school if the teacher organizes it that way—like workbooks or math packets. It’s also a fact that some parents don't even glance inside these backpacks, let alone bother packing them according to the schedule. Instead, the kid ends up lugging around music supplies, science gear, and religious studies books they don't even need that day, simply because some parent thinks "it's easier this way" or "they won't forget anything."
- The material itself is watered down compared to when we were kids. For instance, back in our day, we spent way more hours studying the season. We had to master so many concepts—spring in the garden, spring in the orchard, spring in the woods, spring in the vineyard, weather patterns, how people work, animals in the spring... nowadays, all that is condensed into maybe two lessons. And that's just one subject.
- Kids today are different. People talk about Gen Z—look it up if you want the deep dive, I won't get sidetracked—but the environment they are growing up in is fundamentally different. The circumstances are different.
- Regarding the heavy backpacks—yeah, they're heavy. But I remember my bag being a beast too, back when it felt like it was bursting at the seams once you tossed in the gym clothes. Definitely something that needs addressing. And as for those rolling bags? I have my doubts about how practical they actually are... hm.
On the topic of delaying enrollment—honestly, while intellectual maturity matters, emotional maturity should be the deciding factor. In my opinion, it's the most crucial part of the equation. That extra year can mean the world to certain kids; it gives them time to "ripen," to become more independent, develop social skills, and actually grasp what school is supposed to be. I have a student in my class right now, nearing the end of first grade, who is only just now realizing that school is a real thing. Until now, she was functioning on the level of a four or five-year-old. It’s been an uphill battle for her and her parents to keep up with the curriculum. She simply wasn't ready.
By the way... I'm no expert. I just work in a school.🙂
🙏🙏🙏 I don't have much else to add.
Personally, I'd rather see a child head to school at 6.5 instead of 7.5, provided they met the criteria during the assessment. I suspect that a perfectly healthy seven-year-old will find kindergarten incredibly boring, and after that, they'll likely find first grade quite dull at age eight, too.
I’ve been thinking quite a bit lately about how we approach these little daily hurdles, and it really strikes me how much our environment shapes our perspective. I remember one afternoon back when I was living in the Midwest—just a quiet, slow-moving period in my life—when I realized that most of our frustrations aren't actually about the events themselves, but rather the mental framework we bring to them. It’s easy to get caught up in the noise, but there is such a profound sense of peace to be found when you just take a step back and breathe. It isn't always easy to maintain that level of composure, especially when things feel chaotic, but I truly believe that if we can cultivate that inner stillness, the external world loses its ability to rattle us. It’s a practice, really, much like anything else worth doing. kaže: It’s honestly really encouraging to hear that there are some positive examples out there to look up to.
Here we go again today.🙄 I honestly find that specific time of the month so incredibly draining, especially when I have to spend my days running errands between the local DMV, the post office, and the Social Security Administration just to make sure all my reimbursements and checks get distributed properly.🙂 I found myself standing around for hours again today, just hovering aimlessly. Honestly, there were moments where I felt like being completely rude—just to snap at some random person sitting comfortably in a chair and tell them to get lost.
I ended up having my hands completely full of shopping bags again today. 🙂
I’m honestly a little shaken up by this. I’ve always been the type of person who instinctively makes room and offers my seat to pregnant women whenever I see them, so this feels quite unsettling.
I remember another instance early on in my pregnancy when the morning sickness was absolutely brutal. I had to head out for a checkup and some paperwork at the local Social Security office, and of course, everything was located on the far side of town. Looking back, if I could have just sat down for a moment, I think I would have felt much better and managed the nausea a bit more effectively. While I was struggling, this elderly man walks right up to me and actually tells me to get up, implying that I'm not disabled or anything. I just looked him in the eye and told him, "No thanks, I'm not disabled, I'm pregnant—maybe you can find someone else to stand up for you, but please, try asking nicely first." No worries at all. People can be pretty strange sometimes.
I had similar experiences during my first pregnancy, too. I can count on one hand the number of times anyone actually stood up for me or, heaven forbid, let me cut ahead in line.
Maybe I just take the wrong subway lines, I guess.🤣
When I wasn't pregnant, I almost never sat down—like, ever—but if I ever do end up sitting in the future, I suppose I'll only give up my spot for pregnant women or people with small kids. Otherwise, I'll probably just spend the time staring blankly into the distance.🥳
Laura Barnes42 said:Honestly, just let them babble on. Ever since I became pregnant, I feel like I've been a magnet for nonsense. It started with people asking where my bump is, then suddenly they’re telling me my belly is sitting too high, or even looking at my face to try and guess the gender. I'm just bracing myself for the final wave of comments: "Oh my gosh, you're so big" or "When is the baby coming?" 😁
And don't even get me started on the "well-meaning" advice.
🙂urbantinker8> People can be such jerks, and I honestly find it hard to believe that nobody ever stands up for anyone. To be fair, my only real experience with this was when a woman actually sat right on top of me on a subway once. Though, lately, I haven't even seen a bus because I've been wearing my heavy jacket, so I haven't had much chance to test that theory. Aside from that one bad encounter, I haven't had many positive experiences either.
Well, I suppose it’s nice to know that at least some people are decent.
It happened again today.🙄 It just gets under my skin toward the end of the month, when I'm out running errands, heading to work, stopping by the Social Security office, and dropping off all those various checks.🙂 Once again, I spent hours just standing there on the transit. It almost makes me want to be completely rude and just snap at some random person to get up from their seat with a nasty comment.
And to make matters worse, I was lugging around a ton of grocery bags today too. 🙂
It’s honestly kind of maddening how nobody ever thinks to offer up a seat when I’m on the bus or the subway.😠🙂
I’ve actually been retired for about three months now, and I have to say, getting around has become a bit of a struggle, and standing for long periods just isn't easy for me anymore. But everyone just acts like they don't see anything—I guess the younger crowd is too busy staring at their iPhones, while the middle-aged folks just stare blankly into space, and then you have the elderly people groaning and complaining loudly.🙂
The absolute peak of it happened the other day—I was riding the bus with my little one, who's only three, and I've got a pretty noticeable belly myself; the bus wasn't even crowded, but every single seat was taken, leaving us standing all by ourselves.🙂
Nicholas King said:When you stumble upon a situation where people can't even distinguish between a legitimate debate over dental techniques and mere whining about a botched procedure, it’s enough to make anyone seriously concerned about the state of things.
I suppose—and I might be wrong here, but it seems obvious—that unless someone has a degree in hospitality management and several years of experience working behind a bar, they aren't even qualified to tell a waiter that he served them vomit instead of a cup of coffee.
An outsider trying to lecture a professional on the specific educational methods a teacher should use during their own classroom hours is probably about as useful as an amateur trying to weigh in on the technical nuances of how a dentist treats a cavity.☕ I'm not really talking about simple complaints regarding a bad filling, a mediocre cup of coffee, or perhaps a misguided pedagogical choice.😉
Emily Gonzalez51 said:It seems unprecedented for minors to actually kill a random pedestrian on the street. These are all just school kids.
for example
...who are essentially acting out because public schools are failing them... 🤦
I really don't have the heart to keep arguing here with people whose actual professions I know nothing about, let alone whether they have any real-world experience in education or child development, other than perhaps having sat in a classroom themselves a lifetime ago or maybe having kids who happen to be in school right now. I wouldn't dream of telling a friend who's a dentist how she should go about fixing teeth since I don't know the first thing about dentistry. I certainly wouldn't lecture a friend who works as a judge about legal proceedings, mostly because I'm completely out of my depth there. So, I suppose...☕ Jessica Howard5 actually opened up this discussion in a way that was both sensible and polite, even though it’s clearly a total Pandora's box, but it seems some people here are taking things entirely the wrong way.
Jessica Howard5 said:Yeah. Parents are responsible for their kids' behavior. That much is true. But it feels to me like you people in education are increasingly taking the path of least resistance. Why? Because you're afraid of the fallout, afraid of the district inspectors. Why be afraid if you have the facts on your side? Why be afraid if the law is on your side? What happened? Some Martin Luther King Jr. type or a drunk shows up and starts yelling at you, and you're just standing there helpless? There is such a thing as a formal disciplinary record. As a teacher, you need to document it and justify it with solid arguments. A three-person committee should decide on these matters, and sure, a parent has the right to appeal. They have the right to call the board. So why resist the process? That's what the work should be about. That’s the core issue. Part of the problem is that nobody taught you this in college—nobody taught you how to actually be a homeroom teacher, what to do during advisory periods, let alone how to approach a specific problem or how to handle a parent. Some of you start the conversation with "I called you here to tell you your child is a problem..." Try instead: "I invited you here so we could work together to find a solution for certain issues regarding your child's learning and behavior." Or, "This happened, and I'm asking for your help so we can fix it together." Isn't that approach better? And you should do it the moment you detect the issue, not when everything has already gone to hell. Try using that approach, and even the aggressive ones will run out of ammunition for their outbursts.
I find it somewhat fascinating, I suppose, how the conclusion always seems to be that none of us learned a single useful thing in college, whether we're talking about our actual subject matter or the pedagogical side of teaching.🙄 We act like our specific subject is the only thing that matters, yet we struggle with lesson planning, don't work particularly hard, spend more time relaxing than prepping, demand impossible things from students, have no clue how to run a classroom, can't talk to kids effectively, and apparently don't know how to handle parents either. It’s almost as if we’re entirely unqualified for the jobs we hold. But then again, if we're all so incompetent, where are all those "seasoned experts" hiding??😕 If you're all such master educators, why aren't you actually working in the school system trying to fix the educational framework instead of just typing away on internet forums?🤷
Jason Ortiz5 said:1.) "The guy" isn't complaining about elderly or sick staff members. He's upset because it feels like they're implying those folks don't need to meet professional standards just because they're older or dealing with health issues. For what it's worth, I've had some professors who were practically ancient, and honestly, hats off to them. Some of those veterans were way sharper, more agile, and infinitely more capable than the young, "gifted" kids coming up through the ranks today.
Anyway, my mother-in-law, who used to be a guidance counselor, actually nudged her daughter to take those certification exams back when this company was going through its rough patch. She thought she might land a job teaching vocational subjects. Her whole pitch was that even if you have to deal with some rowdy teenagers and annoying parents occasionally, you get amazing hours, a steady paycheck, and it's a million times better than that soul-crushing sales job she was working before.
I mean, that really just speaks to your mother-in-law's perspective, doesn't it? It doesn't necessarily say much about teachers as a whole group. Those exams are part of what they call the pedagogical subject group.😉 Actually, from what I've seen, I know way more people who jumped ship from school to work for various corporations than the other way around, I suppose.
By the way, did your mother-in-law end up taking that teaching gig?🍿
Nicholas King said:This is simply not the case—you’ve taken what was a relatively benign post about the (lack of) rights held by educators and interpreted it as nothing less than pure hatred toward teachers. It reeks of that uncritical, old-school union solidarity, where people view the entire teaching profession more like a religious dogma than anything else.
Or perhaps you’d care to deny that when you’re sitting in the faculty lounge, you're sharing a table and with the very same kind of people you would probably try to keep at least 50 feet away from children if you had the chance tonight?
It’s certainly not the case that everyone in my staff room is some kind of perfect educator, either in terms of discipline or actual instruction. But no—there aren't any weirdos around me who would warrant a restraining order. Maybe I just happen to be unusually lucky that my colleagues don't all suffer from various personality disorders.🥳
Emily Gonzalez51 said:Does this sound like you're describing a school staffed by creeps, predators, and lunatics? From what authority are you speaking? What is your actual role in the American education system? You're clearly just some former student who spent their time causing trouble in class decades ago. 😁
Nicholas King said:To put it bluntly—the more an activist describes their job as some high-stakes blend of open-heart surgery and building a spacecraft for NASA, the more they're going to attract equally extreme opinions from the "other side of the aisle."
Now, no sane person is going to deny the actual value that activism brings to the table, but this pervasive tendency toward self-pity—this constant need to play the martyr—is, I suppose, just plain senseless 😁.
🙄 I guess all this self-pity just stems from the fact that we've been catching heat from every single direction for years now. I’m really just speaking for myself here, though. I still genuinely love my job and I have no intention of walking away from it right now, but—yeah—I do feel pretty exhausted and honestly just worn down by the general atmosphere currently prevailing across the country.
Nicholas King As specified by Nicholas King: There is a massive distinction between saying people aren't breaking a sweat and claiming they’re just sitting around sipping lattes. I don't see any evidence that the public school teachers are slacking off, so I certainly won't go as far as to say they're doing nothing all day.
Tvoj The bottom line is this: we’ve reached a verdict. As a school psychologist, I find myself in complete agreement with this position. The sheer lack of logic in these recent rulings is absolutely staggering. It’s like watching a slow-motion train wreck where nobody bothers to check the tracks..
Compared to psychologists, teachers are absolutely overworked. Five back-to-back 45-minute sessions of intense mental strain will drain a person dry, much like an empty gas tank on a long highway trip.
I’m in on this.
Nicholas King said:Honestly, I’m reading this and just laughing until I cry.
I guess it’s probably just because you’ve never actually given it a shot before.
Ugh. kohortas, you’ve really gone and opened Pandora's box here, trying to shake things up or maybe just hoping to get a clear look at how messy everything actually is. 😁 I mean, good for you, I guess. 🙏 Of course there are great teachers and then there are... well, other teachers. It’s the same with doctors, accountants, lawyers—you know, different levels of competence across the board.
But hey, if it makes you feel any better, not every professor thinks their subject is the center of the universe. I certainly don't. Even though, realistically speaking, my field is probably way more important than half the stuff out there. 😁 But I’ve never once looked at my work as being the alpha and omega of existence. Sadly, there are colleagues who act like their specific subject is the only thing that matters, but from what I’ve seen, that usually comes down to the older crowd, the old school types. We younger ones tend to be a bit more flexible about all that. 😁
And seminars... man... It feels like ages since I sat through a decent one. For about four years now, they’ve been strictly focused on standardized testing and state curriculum requirements. It’s mostly politics and very little actual teaching or development. That’s all I’m going to say about that particular sore spot. ☕
nosorog, maybe I'm misreading things, but reading between the lines of your posts—well, most of them, anyway—I catch this deep sense of resentment and anger toward teachers. 🤷 I get the impression you think everyone is chronically lacking in pedagogical skill and that truly good professors just don't exist anymore. And while we're talking about discipline—a teacher's job is to address undesirable behavior in students, not their parents. If a student is picking up those bad habits at home because they're mirroring their parents, that’s a whole different issue. Bad parenting should be dealt with by someone else entirely, but most of the time, that "someone else" either isn't there or just doesn't bother to step in. Anyway, I guess we're just running in circles again.
I, urbantinker8, where is all this sudden animosity toward professors coming from? Was your own experience in school really that much of a nightmare—like, were they all just completely incompetent, narrow-minded, or somehow actively malicious...?
Susan James said:But what does "cooperation" actually look like to you or the teachers? How exactly would a cooperative parent change the vibe in the classroom? In what way would that actually make your job easier? Has anyone here actually dealt with a supportive parent who managed to turn things around in class? What did that process look like for you? 🙂
Well, kohortas is basically the gold standard for a parent who actually cooperates.🙂
Jessica Howard5 said:I’m interested too, but let me give you my take based on experience. I show up to conferences regularly—every other week, twice a month. I know most parents only care about grades, but I want to know how my kids are acting in class and how they get along with their peers. Grades come second; I only bring up excuses if something actually needs justifying. If a teacher tells me my kid is restless, disrupting the lesson, talking over people, or having beef with other students... then I step in. That's when I work on correcting the behavior. To me, that's what parent-school cooperation looks like. And I expect the same from the school—that they actually address and correct my child's behavior while they're on campus. This seems to be aimed at the parents (presumably) who don't bother doing that. I know plenty of kids who are straight-A geniuses but act like total disasters during class or in the halls. Most of their parents couldn't care less because the grades are fine, and they just don't give a damn about anything else. That's the problem, in my opinion.
If everyone acted like him, I suspect we wouldn't be facing half these problems.🙂
Jessica Howard5 said:Sorry frupy, but those stereotypes mostly come from the "enlightened" types, including some folks on this very forum. Just skim a few threads and you'll see what I mean. Again, they're probably the minority, but they're loud enough to make it seem otherwise.
My stance remains the same based on experience. You're right about the parents and the lack of cooperation; it's happened before and it'll happen again. More and more parents are checking out. So, I'm asking all you "experts" and "pros": can a school actually fix this? Is there a legal way? Is there any actual will to do it? Can extreme cases that a school can't handle be handed off to another agency or authority? And don't tell me that if a parent refuses to help when their kid is terrorizing a classroom, the school is just supposed to sit there and take it. Is that really how it works? Because if it is, our society is in serious trouble.
Not quite. On paper, we have certain authorities, but institutions tend to get very quiet when you're dealing with someone suffering from severe PTSD, a notorious criminal, or some local big shot, and so on. The buck gets passed from one office to another, and you never see any real results. So, I guess the most accurate way to put it would be: we have some authority, but it feels like we don't have any at all.
Jessica Howard5 said:I remember those types of characters from back then, too. I remember fights breaking out right in front of the school because kids from other schools showed up specifically to scrap. There was never a shortage of reasons—losing an interscholastic game, some girl walking with a guy from our school... it was always happening (unfortunately), and it’ll keep happening. But that stuff happened both inside and outside of school, and that's a police matter. Same goes for neighborhood gangs; they've always existed and always will. That's also a police matter. What actually worries me is how indifferent schools have become toward handling problems within their own walls. Nowadays, it's become trendy to say, "We can't," "We aren't allowed," "We don't have the authority..." or "That's not our business, we aren't here to raise other people's kids..." That's what bugs me. Invoking the "old days" only works in the sense that back then, schools actually knew how, wanted to, and were able to deal with things. What has actually changed about kids from then to now? Almost nothing. They're basically the same, just with smartphones and TVs added to the mix... Bottom line: the kids haven't changed much, but the schools have (in terms of approach, willpower, and problem-solving). So let's stop judging the kids. They need help—every single one of them, including both the victims and the bullies. I just think that with the increasingly common attitude among educators that this isn't their job or responsibility, we're seeing worse and worse results, and the gap between the two groups of kids and their parents is just widening.
I'm not quite sure why you aren't actually reading what people are saying here. I guess all the effort in the world won't matter if the parents refuse to work with us. If the parents of even one—and let's be honest, there are way too many—troublemaker decide they don't want to cooperate, the whole classroom atmosphere can just fall apart. Believe me, this idea that looking after these kids isn't our responsibility is just an empty stereotype, and it seems like maybe you've fallen for it too.