Is spirituality a form of personal growth?

Nancy Thompson3 said:That’s fine. Really. If you don't have an ego, I suppose you could live that way. Just endure the winters, the cold, the insults, and the constant condescension from the Siemens crowd who love to judge you for not being exactly like them... But no, I won't do that. I’m choosing to walk my own path, and that doesn't mean living in a gutter, nor does it mean grinding away in some cubicle wearing a button-down and a tie.

I've made up my mind, and it's final... if you all expect me to just conform, then don't expect to see me around anymore..
If you catch my drift...

I hear you. Respect!

🙏 👍
Hallelujah.

Hannah Morris3 said:Up, the real illusion is thinking you can be a free individual while still trying to fit into the mold of society.

Technically, you can,
but you'll just end up being a complete sellout in the process.😛

Nancy Thompson3 said:Fine. If that's how we're going to play this game.
Do you honestly think Vestax offers any kind of liberation?
Look, here's my take: people are drowning in consumerism. It’s constant—just gathering more stuff and blowing money on material goods. Even the church complains that its congregation would rather spend their time at the local mall than sitting in a pew.
People judge each other based entirely on what they own.
And when things fall apart, they turn to drugs to cope. Within the DJ scene, cocaine dealing is basically thriving—you see it everywhere from guys like Kala to those types over at the Apartment or Pif, or even Charlemagne.

Where is the "liberation" in that? To me, that's just mindless vegetating.

🙂

I'm not sure why you're so hung up on "Sony," since Panasonic is the top-tier, high-end brand for turntables...

But I get where you're coming from. I spent plenty of time bouncing around parties back in the day, and I used to own gear and DJ myself.

The drug situation is obvious, but honestly, substances are more prevalent now than ever.
What can I say... Personally, I'd rather just live a quiet life like a regular DJ than be on Valium just to "get through" life.
And it's true—when people snap, they reach for drugs.

So, you see the whole picture clearly... It seems like you do. Doesn't it all just disgust you?
It honestly turns my stomach, and you know what else? The way waitresses flirt at certain bars really gets to me too. The whole scene is repulsive to me, and there isn't a single soul who could convince me to get involved in that kind of lifestyle...

Hannah Morris3 said:Up, the real illusion is thinking you can be a free individual while still trying to fit into the mold of society.

I don't recall ever saying I thought I needed to belong to any kind of society...

Noah Sanchez7 said:I don't recall ever saying I thought I needed to belong to any kind of society...

Where do you even live—in the middle of nowhere?

Noah Sanchez7 said:🙂

I'm not sure why you're so hung up on "Sony," since Panasonic is the top-tier, high-end brand for turntables...

But I get where you're coming from. I spent plenty of time bouncing around parties back in the day, and I used to own gear and DJ myself.

The drug situation is obvious, but honestly, substances are more prevalent now than ever.
What can I say... Personally, I'd rather just live a quiet life like a regular DJ than be on Valium just to "get through" life.
And it's true—when people snap, they reach for drugs.

So, you see the whole picture clearly... It seems like you do. Doesn't it all just disgust you?
It honestly turns my stomach, and you know what else? The way waitresses flirt at certain bars really gets to me too. The whole scene is repulsive to me, and there isn't a single soul who could convince me to get involved in that kind of lifestyle...

Exactly. I don't do it either, and frankly, it's sickening.

Noah Sanchez7 said:That’s completely incorrect. If that were true, you'd be denying the entire purpose of enlightenment or Budō, which wasn't just achieved by Buddha, but by many others, including Mahavira.

Of course, you don't get there by "cementing" anything; it's actually the exact opposite—it comes from persistently breaking down those deep-seated "walls" within the very core of our existence.
Those walls and limitations are what make us human—limited beings destined to experience constant cycles of falling and rising...

What part isn't true? That a person isn't Bud?

Obviously, you don't get there by "building up," but by doing the exact opposite: relentlessly tearing down those internal "walls" buried deep within the core of our existence.
Those walls, that sense of limitation, are what make us human—you know, that flawed, limited version of ourselves destined to constantly stumble and recover...

You missed my point entirely. 😉 I clearly stated that those "walls" and limitations *are* the Ego.

Lisa Cox4 said:What part isn't true? That a person isn't Bud?

Obviously, you don't get there by "building up," but by doing the exact opposite: relentlessly tearing down those internal "walls" buried deep within the core of our existence.
Those walls, that sense of limitation, are what make us human—you know, that flawed, limited version of ourselves destined to constantly stumble and recover...

You missed my point entirely. 😉 I clearly stated that those "walls" and limitations *are* the Ego.

Just a misunderstanding...

And saying people are already Buddhas is wrong. I agree with that, but I also believe we can become them.;

Hannah Morris3 said:Where do you even live—in the middle of nowhere?

I don't live in the woods; I live in the city..

Noah Sanchez7 said:I don't live in the woods; I live in the city..

So, you're part of society after all...

Hannah Morris3 said:So, you're part of society after all...

That doesn't necessarily follow logically..

Even less intuitive than they look.

Brandon Hall88 said:Even less intuitive than they look.

"I am Mracan, like an ambis you must descend into to find the one you are looking for"

That’s from your signature. If you actually know, please tell me: how does one get out of this ambis I've clearly fallen into?

I sent you a message.

Noah Sanchez7 said:That doesn't necessarily follow logically..

If you live in a city, you’re living within a system built on connectivity, interdependence, and cooperation—plain and simple. You don't exist in a vacuum; you're part of a community, and I honestly don't get why you're so desperate to deny that. It's just a fact.

Hannah Morris3 said:If you live in a city, you’re living within a system built on connectivity, interdependence, and cooperation—plain and simple. You don't exist in a vacuum; you're part of a community, and I honestly don't get why you're so desperate to deny that. It's just a fact.

I guess you can still live in total isolation even in a city. A lot of practitioners actually prefer it that way. When you're in a massive metropolitan area, you're actually most protected—mostly because of the sheer MASS of people.
It’s hard for anyone to target you with specific negative energy when it just gets swallowed up by the crowd. In a huge city, people are so incredibly different from one another, and honestly, nobody cares about your differences anyway. So, a practitioner can hide in plain sight quite effectively under those conditions.
On top of that, there’s no real need to dive headfirst into urban social life. You don't have to mingle or hang out with anyone if you don't want to. You can be completely isolated, and nobody is going to pull you aside to ask why you're being such a hermit... which, let's face it, is pretty much impossible to do in a small rural town.

There really are only two ways to be alone: either you retreat into some desolate mountain cave, or you disappear into the middle of a city with millions of people.

He wasn't talking about being lonely—he was claiming he isn't part of society. Which is absurd. We're all part of it, whether we like it or not—we either follow the rules imposed on us or face the consequences. Talking about some grand sense of freedom in this context feels like an illusion to me. The reality is simply that some societies are less repressive than others; as a woman, I’m well aware of that. America is actually doing alright. At least it's no longer illegal to be a vegetarian here. We're making progress. Though, I doubt they'd let some kid just sit under a tree and meditate for a year—like that little boy in Nepal... In that case, the authorities would move heaven and earth to stick that poor child into some "appropriate" institution.
You're only free inside your own head (if anyone is)—for now, at least, we can still think whatever we want. As for everything else? Forget it—unless you have the money (power) to buy yourself a little extra breathing room.

And for all we know, he wasn't even talking about the kind of society you’re picturing. He might have meant something entirely different when he said he doesn't belong. Maybe the real "society" is just the one we carry inside ourselves... the internal noise. Perhaps it’s actually harder to purge that inner conditioning than it is to simply walk away from the crowd.
Maybe...
Or maybe not... 🙂

Is it actually possible to fully strip away society's influence from your psyche? Has anyone ever truly pulled that off?

Hannah Morris3 said:Is it actually possible to fully strip away society's influence from your psyche? Has anyone ever truly pulled that off?

Only if you're a highly successful autistic person with decades of practice under your belt...